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Fatal Guillotine
01-15-2012, 12:06 PM
just a thought

if a skilled martial artist were to square up against a skilled boxer lets say 4 rounds(amateur type ish). who would win in your opinion?

check two
01-15-2012, 11:04 PM
Tough call, but Hogan defeated Zeus

Fatal Guillotine
01-17-2012, 10:01 AM
i;ve given this some thought and the concept of the martial artist punching at the center line i think that this could be a a major factor in a fight between the two

check two
01-17-2012, 11:33 AM
I would go with martial artist. Boxers tend not to have the highest IQ's.

Fatal Guillotine
01-17-2012, 11:44 AM
some martial artist need space especially in regards to kicks

Fatal Guillotine
01-18-2012, 11:42 AM
will-power plays a major role

kurupt_kw
01-18-2012, 12:43 PM
James Toney fought Randy Couture back in 2010 and didn't make it out of the first round. He got taken down and that was the end of the fight because he had no idea how to defend or get out of that position.

G.O.D.F.A.T.H.A.
01-18-2012, 01:12 PM
in my opinion, boxers are tougher than most of your martial arts fighters. boxers normally take hundreds, if not thousands of punches to the head and body, during sparring sessions and actual matches.....the condition of competitive professional boxers and muay thai kickboxers is exceptional and the best conditioned athletes in the world......most martial artists rarely take solid shots to the chin and when they do they crumble in a heap and find themselves on the mat...

boxer vs martial arts? depends on the fighter......but i'd put my money on a good, quality boxer any day....

and for those of you movie fanatics and superhero fantasy types that watch what people do on t.v. and think they can actually do it in real life are either nieve or just plain stupid.....especially since i can guarantee that none have ever seen a REAL fight between two highly conditioned, trained athletes.....

with that being said, mike tyson would destroy both jackie chan and bruce lee on the same day easily.....jackie and bruce weighed what 145lbs each? please, do you really think that a supreme, powerful heavyweight boxing champion at his peak that was able to absorb tremendous punishment from powerful heavyweights could ever be hurt by such tiny men???????are you on crack?

do you think manny pacquiao at 147lbs could hurt any heavyweight boxer? do you think jackie chan or bruce lee hit harder than manny? this weight class type of fighter could never generate the force or power in their bodies to hurt a prime mike tyson....believing in one-inch punches or phantom kicks, c'mon man....just because a karate man can chop a block of concrete, does that mean he can do that to someones head? please, stop believing in fairy tale superhero, karatekid, mr. miyagi, santa claus bullshit and get with the program.......some of these martial arts fans are the same ones that watch a van damme or chuck norris movie, get pumped up, believe it, then go kick their dog or little sister and think they're some martial arts fighter...so what the ***?

that's why weight classes exist in all fighting sports and mma figured out pretty quick when homeboy royce gracie started having problems with bigger, stronger fighters......they had to change the rules and created weight divisions.....

i've always said that most wrestlers, martial artists and football players hide behind their weak *** chins and avoid boxing where the potential for million dollar fights can be made. but they avoid it, cause they just don't have the heart and hide behind a glass jaw. if you're a bad ***, step into the ring and throw down...then talk all the shyt you want.

Fatal Guillotine
01-18-2012, 02:51 PM
lets not forget that muscle memory leads to speed

dont forget about how Joe Louis once use a punch that was similar to an one-inch

also like godfatha as it pertains to jiu-jitsu i dont think a person is going to go for a takedown. most martial artist are taught to punch at the centerline (those cats that know about tai chi, wing chun or jeet kune do know what im referring to).

i think theres pros and cons with each but it soley depends on the fighter

good points though G

100pr00f
01-18-2012, 03:09 PM
the mixed martial artist would win every time

or u can say the weakest gracie in the gracie family could beat the best boxer lol
its been done tons of times

kurupt_kw
01-18-2012, 03:54 PM
It really depends on what we're talking about. Is the OP talking about 4 rounds of boxing or MMA? If it's 4 rounds of boxing I take the boxer all the time and vice versa.

You can bring in a boxer and match him up with an MMA guy who is a one dimensional striker like a Cheick Kongo and make the fight competitive. However, the boxer is not going to be comfortable enough to just sit back and be able to use his boxing skills. Essentially he won't be the same fighter in the cage so he would be more prone to making mistakes that a skilled MMA fighter can recognize and capitalize on. If he comes in with the attitude that he's going to stand and box then he's fucked. (see James Toney)

Your whole point about Bruce Lee/Jackie Chan (+ most of your rant) was fairly ridiculous. What does VanDamme have anything to do with MMA? I think you're in fantasy land about what MMA is. Actually, feel free to check out Pettis' ko of Benson Henderson. That looks like something that you would see in a VanDamme movie and guess what, it worked. To add to that, one of MMA's greatest champions Anderson Silva knocked out Vitor Belfort with an impressive front kick and guess who he credits for teaching him that technique? Steven Seagal.

Tell ya what, do me a favor and find the Barboza ko from last weeks UFC and tell me that MMA is all fantasy bullshit. He's only 155 lbs. and even though it may not put Tyson to sleep, even he would be dazed from that. I bet there are some 155 lb fighters who could beat Tyson in an MMA fight. A 155 lb guy with good ground skills and body control can feel like he's 300 lbs when he's on top of you.

MMA fighters not tough? See Frank Mir break Big Nog's arm because Nog is too proud to tap out. Look at his stone face as he casually lays there looking at his snapped arm like it's no big deal. Maybe you watched one Brock Lesnar fight (who is a wrestler who tried MMA) who clearly doesn't like to get hit and formed your opinion off that? If you actually watched any MMA you would not have the opinion that these guys run and hide from punishment.

check two
01-18-2012, 03:57 PM
Butter Bean could beat some MMA fighters. Besides him, not so much. Midget Mayweather beats his girlfriend, but that's about it.

kurupt_kw
01-18-2012, 04:04 PM
the mixed martial artist would win every time

or u can say the weakest gracie in the gracie family could beat the best boxer lol
its been done tons of times

I bet even Kyra can hang with the best of them. ha ha

THE W
01-18-2012, 08:03 PM
an MMAer would win pretty easy in a no-holds-barred matchup. the boxer would be done for once they get grappled.

$inista
01-18-2012, 09:55 PM
MMA all day but hes got to be careful all it takes is one good punh

Teh KillaBee
01-18-2012, 11:29 PM
no matter where you go, Bruce Lee always wins

Fatal Guillotine
01-19-2012, 08:29 AM
i belive bruce lee lost some fights too

THE MASON
01-19-2012, 10:04 AM
really depends on the rules you apply to the match

is it an MMA style fight or a Boxing match, one will lend an advantage to the other.

Fatal Guillotine
01-19-2012, 10:33 AM
just a regular match 4 rounds

Fatal Guillotine
01-19-2012, 04:57 PM
anyone knows if mma fighter practice The plus (+) exercise. its an exercise use to establish footwork that most boxers learn

Teh KillaBee
01-19-2012, 07:59 PM
MMA all day but hes got to be careful all it takes is one good punh

tell that to James Toney, an aging old man destroyed him without even getting touched with a jab

THE MASON
01-19-2012, 11:53 PM
just a regular match 4 rounds

ye but i mean, if you go by boxing standards. take downs arent allowed, so that gives the edge to the boxer, but if you use mma rules, it opens the field much more and MMA fighters will win

but seeing as MMA is most similar to a "showing of skill" type fight, then MMA all day. they train in numerous styles and have more options mentally and physically

BrokenWrists
01-21-2012, 12:25 AM
A martial artist has more options, suck as kicks, uses of different parts of the body like knees, elbows, throws, limb grabs, takedowns etc. Wheres the boxer relies on punches and dodges. Like someone said before, one punch from a boxer could end it, and vise versa. It really comes down to who is the better fighter.

food for thought
01-21-2012, 12:29 AM
Martial artist ass niggas will kick you in your lip before you get a punch off.

$inista
01-21-2012, 01:09 AM
how many MMA fights have you watch that ended with striking LOTS! don't sleep on hand skills it is an important element of the game, I think it does boil down to the fighter & his game plan, endurance, coach, referee even there is a lot that goes into these fights MMA or BOXING, however a MMA fighter has more tricks in the bag so he defiantly has the advantage

http://youtu.be/VNYpR_tDqSQ

the insignificant
01-21-2012, 01:21 AM
the rules still haven't been properly established here... but if it's anything other than a straight boxing match, the mma guy wins easily...

if the boxer has to avoid anything other than punches, watch his hands drop and the mma guy come right over the top with a knock out punch or kick... if it goes to the ground the boxer gets completely embarassed... and also, the boxer isn't used to being hit with mma gloves...

if a boxer gets knocked down he's used to a standing count, if an mma guy gets put down, his opponent jumps on him and lays into him... so even it it's about purely striking (including knees, elbows and kicks) the mma fighter has too much arsenal and very likely more composure under attack too...

Fatal Guillotine
01-21-2012, 03:21 PM
what if we were to eliminated elbows

Dirty Knowledge
01-21-2012, 11:32 PM
thread should be renamed to

Bruce Lee vs Muhammad Ali

Nick Fury
01-22-2012, 01:36 PM
ii-MLjI5Fyc

IrOnMaN
01-25-2012, 05:13 PM
Martial Artists have the upper hand due to the fact that they are trained in numerous types of fighting.

For example, let's say that a fight broke out b/w a skilled boxer and a skilled martial artist. The boxer is 195lbs and stands at 6'2'' while the martial artist is 186lbs and stands at 5'10''. The martial artist has a black belt in jujutsu and he's extremely FAST. However, the boxer is a lot more conditioned that the martial artist.

The thing that people have to keep in mind is that Boxers need space in order to fight because that's how they're trained while martial artists are trained in both open space and close space.

The martial artist will win because he has the upper hand.

Cenon
02-01-2012, 07:35 PM
It all depends on the fighter and circumstance. If it's purely stand up (like kick boxing) the boxer has a decent chance depending on his skills. Lots of fighters in K-1(kick boxing org.) Do very well with very limited kicks. Look up Jerome Le Banner, sure he has won knockouts by kicks. However his punches are insane. Then again if you got 2 guys with near equal boxing but the other guy has superb kicks/knees he's gonna win every time. He can gauge the distance and pace.

If its anything goes an MMA fighter even with low level jui jitsu, who is yet athletic will beat a boxer. What good are accurate overhand counters when you're on your back?

JASPER BEARDLY
02-02-2012, 04:29 PM
in my opinion, boxers are tougher than most of your martial arts fighters. boxers normally take hundreds, if not thousands of punches to the head and body, during sparring sessions and actual matches.....the condition of competitive professional boxers and muay thai kickboxers is exceptional and the best conditioned athletes in the world......most martial artists rarely take solid shots to the chin and when they do they crumble in a heap and find themselves on the mat...

boxer vs martial arts? depends on the fighter......but i'd put my money on a good, quality boxer any day....

and for those of you movie fanatics and superhero fantasy types that watch what people do on t.v. and think they can actually do it in real life are either nieve or just plain stupid.....especially since i can guarantee that none have ever seen a REAL fight between two highly conditioned, trained athletes.....

with that being said, mike tyson would destroy both jackie chan and bruce lee on the same day easily.....jackie and bruce weighed what 145lbs each? please, do you really think that a supreme, powerful heavyweight boxing champion at his peak that was able to absorb tremendous punishment from powerful heavyweights could ever be hurt by such tiny men???????are you on crack?

do you think manny pacquiao at 147lbs could hurt any heavyweight boxer? do you think jackie chan or bruce lee hit harder than manny? this weight class type of fighter could never generate the force or power in their bodies to hurt a prime mike tyson....believing in one-inch punches or phantom kicks, c'mon man....just because a karate man can chop a block of concrete, does that mean he can do that to someones head? please, stop believing in fairy tale superhero, karatekid, mr. miyagi, santa claus bullshit and get with the program.......some of these martial arts fans are the same ones that watch a van damme or chuck norris movie, get pumped up, believe it, then go kick their dog or little sister and think they're some martial arts fighter...so what the ***?

that's why weight classes exist in all fighting sports and mma figured out pretty quick when homeboy royce gracie started having problems with bigger, stronger fighters......they had to change the rules and created weight divisions.....

i've always said that most wrestlers, martial artists and football players hide behind their weak *** chins and avoid boxing where the potential for million dollar fights can be made. but they avoid it, cause they just don't have the heart and hide behind a glass jaw. if you're a bad ***, step into the ring and throw down...then talk all the shyt you want.


good points but to put jackie chan and bruce lee in the same category seems retarded to me

i think bruce lee would fuck tyson up actually and i'm a big tyson fan and seen a lot of his fights, especially after his prime bruce would murder him.

in his prime, hard to say, but i don't think tyson would be able to touch bruce and bruce would destroy tysons legs with kicks and probably knock him out with a kick to the face

Big Baby Jesus 666
02-03-2012, 04:12 PM
Martial Arts i say but boxers know how to handle themselves too!!!Depends who's fighting


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3PSMC3Xvl8

$inista
02-03-2012, 05:54 PM
@ godfatha bro i love boxing but really? boxers got them big ass gloves , there are going to endure more punches, put them lil MMA gloves see how fast shit is over good quality boxers has to do more then just box james toney, butterbean, kimbo slice brawler knocking niggas out fought mma & niggas failed it just two different sports with different rules, same if you put a mma fighter in a boxing ring he is done! as far as toughness i say their equally tuff as nails if not mma being more tuff niggas is getting arms popped out of joints and shit, still going at it

Fatal Guillotine
02-27-2012, 09:36 AM
okay lets say the martial artist is a practitioner of wing chun

lets place him in a match with the boxer

what would be the outcome

angry!
02-27-2012, 12:36 PM
if a pro boxer trained take down defense for a year in a gym with elite wrestlers and worked heavily on scrambles back to the feet youd see them destroy MMA....

james toney was fat and old by the time he gave it a chance he was looking for one big shot and couldnt get it...

say roy jones in his prime did nothing but drill sprawls and scrambles... his spacing, and speed, would have guys laying out bleeding out the face looking at the ceiling with lights in their eyes...

you wont see it happen until the boxers can get a bigger pay day in MMA...moneys not there...

id like to see badr hari train TDD and scrambles cuz he would light dudes up with small gloves but he doesnt like MMA... k-1 is dead and hed be a star but i guess he wants to try boxing, i can see him having success there aswell...

bottom line 2 different sports but the boxer could mkae the jump with the work...

randy couture would get KO'd opening round by fat james toney in a boxing match... he was offered a million to fight lights out in a ring and turned it down... ill takea million bucks and stand with lights out.. theyd wake me up and id be smiling...

angry!
02-27-2012, 12:46 PM
mike tyson in his prime was the perfect specimen...

speed, defense, spacing, combos, and power...

give that guy 6 months in an MMA gym to work on staying upright...

drill sprawls and scrambles...

hed be knocking wrestlers out with hooks and uppercuts...

can you imagine mike tyson beating on a shelled MMA fighter against the fence?!!?!?!!?!?!?

mike tyson dropping you then hitting the mat to follow it up with ground and pound?!!?!?!?!?

he had the power to rip away from the clinch, spin and stay upright... and was a quick learner that responded to good coaching...

alistair overeem won k-1 grand prix but his style is unique... hes so massive he plods forward with his arms up, lets you rip off a combo as hes shelled up... then returns one or two punches with a knee and youre fucked up... hes not your typical kickboxer, he uses raw power and walks into range he doesnt really use spacing like that... he cant do that same plodding shell defense in MMA cuz the gloves leave holes in his guard... he can still clinch you up and rip knees to your face and body but its a whole different game...

Cenon
03-18-2012, 03:22 PM
mike tyson in his prime was the perfect specimen...

speed, defense, spacing, combos, and power...

give that guy 6 months in an MMA gym to work on staying upright...

drill sprawls and scrambles...

hed be knocking wrestlers out with hooks and uppercuts...

can you imagine mike tyson beating on a shelled MMA fighter against the fence?!!?!?!!?!?!?

mike tyson dropping you then hitting the mat to follow it up with ground and pound?!!?!?!?!?

he had the power to rip away from the clinch, spin and stay upright... and was a quick learner that responded to good coaching...

alistair overeem won k-1 grand prix but his style is unique... hes so massive he plods forward with his arms up, lets you rip off a combo as hes shelled up... then returns one or two punches with a knee and youre fucked up... hes not your typical kickboxer, he uses raw power and walks into range he doesnt really use spacing like that... he cant do that same plodding shell defense in MMA cuz the gloves leave holes in his guard... he can still clinch you up and rip knees to your face and body but its a whole different game...
That's the thing, after that much training he's no longer a boxing purist.

rakimkoolgrapwutang
03-18-2012, 04:55 PM
i remember seeing this on discussion in a tv program called q.i. apparently most fighting experts agree that a boxers upper body is a lot faster than a martial artists upper body and a lot stronger. also apparently in a normal fight legs are not used that much hardly any kicks are used. most experts apparently said the boxer would win

angry!
03-18-2012, 06:00 PM
That's the thing, after that much training he's no longer a boxing purist.
see the thing is though...

someone that trains MMA their whole fight career can never dedicate enough time to their boxing to become an elite boxer that would be competitive on the professional level...

where as a boxers techinical base in boxing is already so elite... they can lose some points in that area focusing on other areas and still be head and shoulders above the average boxing specialist in MMA....

a boxer could enter MMA, drill takedown defense and scrambles and defensive BJJ and be competitive.. theyd just need to train with wrestlers and work on staying up and getting up...

some boxers are flat footed plodding counter punchers... like james toney...

but a guy like manny pac throws punches and comes in and out of range with lightening speed... i could see many pac ruining cats in MMA after 6 months in a wrestling heavy MMA gym...

if youre boxing is good enough you dont even need to know how to check a leg kick because youd control the range...

the money just isnt there yet... i think well see it eventually...

june181972
03-18-2012, 08:24 PM
really depends on the rules you apply to the match

is it an MMA style fight or a Boxing match, one will lend an advantage to the other.

This is really the issue
These organizations have rules, the advantage depends on what rules are being applied
But in the real world, ain't nothin' fair about a fight
If one has to clench the other guy's testicles between his teeth, that's what they gotta do in a real fight.

But for the sake of this thread, boxers spend a lot of training time on footwork, and it does not take absolutely great footwork to avoid a "shooting" or "lunging" take down. It only takes 5 lbs of pressure to knock anybody out

Cenon
03-19-2012, 06:22 PM
see the thing is though...

someone that trains MMA their whole fight career can never dedicate enough time to their boxing to become an elite boxer that would be competitive on the professional level...

where as a boxers techinical base in boxing is already so elite... they can lose some points in that area focusing on other areas and still be head and shoulders above the average boxing specialist in MMA....

a boxer could enter MMA, drill takedown defense and scrambles and defensive BJJ and be competitive.. theyd just need to train with wrestlers and work on staying up and getting up...

some boxers are flat footed plodding counter punchers... like james toney...

but a guy like manny pac throws punches and comes in and out of range with lightening speed... i could see many pac ruining cats in MMA after 6 months in a wrestling heavy MMA gym...

if youre boxing is good enough you dont even need to know how to check a leg kick because youd control the range...

the money just isnt there yet... i think well see it eventually...


It's gonna take a bit longer learning to counter the ground game within just a year. Especially with guys like this around

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YD4348F5lrA

Theres so much involved. However i completley agree Atheletes in Boxing would adapt much better going to MMA than the other way around. Sad thing is the money isnt in it. When pac and mayweather were about to fight they were offered what 60m to win 40m to lose? That's insane. MMA money is like shoe money for those guys lol.

Drunken Monk
04-17-2012, 02:46 PM
just a thought

if a skilled martial artist were to square up against a skilled boxer lets say 4 rounds(amateur type ish). who would win in your opinion?

martial artist , at least being a high belt

Fatal Guillotine
04-18-2012, 09:08 AM
It's gonna take a bit longer learning to counter the ground game within just a year. Especially with guys like this around

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YD4348F5lrA

Theres so much involved. However i completley agree Atheletes in Boxing would adapt much better going to MMA than the other way around. Sad thing is the money isnt in it. When pac and mayweather were about to fight they were offered what 60m to win 40m to lose? That's insane. MMA money is like shoe money for those guys lol.

truth

Nomad-1
04-19-2012, 11:14 PM
There's a difference between boxing and fighting, same with MMA and fighting. Both have rules.
Iron Mike in his prime, only needs to land A punch.
On the other hand, he misses and gets taken to the floor and he'd likely lose.
Of course, MMA has a lot of rules these days. He's liable to bite, elbow, scratch and those guys get upset over little stuff. Dude was crazy and powerful at the same time. Bad combination.
I guess it depends, on who the fighters are.

Fatal Guillotine
04-20-2012, 09:37 AM
makes me think of the james toney randy couture fight.