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Aqueous Moon
05-29-2006, 01:07 PM
Breaking The Cycle Of White Dependencehttp://www.raceandhistory.com/Historians/images/rahb.gif (http://www.raceandhistory.com/)



May 25, 2001
By Tim Wise

I think it's called 'projection.' When someone subconsciously realizes that a particular trait applies to them, and then attempts to locate that trait in others, so as to alleviate the stigma or self-doubt engendered by the trait in question.

It's a well-understood concept of modern psychology, and explains much: like why men who are struggling with their own sexuality are often the most outwardly homophobic. Or the way whites during slavery typified black men as rapists, even though the primary rapists were the white slaveowners themselves, taking liberties with their female property, or white men generally, raping their wives with impunity.

I got to thinking about projection recently, after receiving many an angry e-mail from folks who had read one or another of my previous commentaries, and felt the need to inform me that people of color are "looking for a handout," and are "dependent" on government, and of course, whites.

Such claims are making the rounds these days, especially as debate heats up about such issues as reparations for enslavement, or affirmative action. And this critique is a prime example of projection, for in truth, no people have been as dependent on others throughout history as white folks.

We depended on laws to defend slavery and segregation so as to elevate us, politically, socially and economically. We depended on the Naturalization Act of 1790, to make all European immigrants eligible for nearly automatic citizenship, with rights above all persons of color. We depended on land giveaways like the Homestead Act, and housing subsidies that were essentially white-only for many years, like FHA and VA loans. Even the GI Bill was largely for whites only, and all of these government-sponsored efforts were instrumental in creating the white middle class. But it goes deeper than that.

From the earliest days, "whites" were dependent on the land and natural resources of the Americas, Africa, and Asia. Since Europe offered no substantial natural riches from its soil, European economic advance and expansion was entirely reliant on the taking of other people's land by force, trickery or coercion. That, my friends, is dependence.

Then these same Europeans relied on slave labor to build a new nation and to create wealth for whites; wealth that was instrumental to financing the American Revolution, as well as allowing the textile and tobacco industries to emerge as international powerhouses. From 1790 to 1860 alone, whites and the overall economy reaped the benefits of as much as $40 billion in unpaid black labor. That, my friends, is dependence.

Though apologists for black oppression enjoy pointing out that Africans often sold other Africans into slavery, this too indicates just how dependent whites have been on black people: having to pay and bribe Africans to catch their own and deliver them to us so as to fatten the profits of European elites. We couldn't even do that by ourselves.

Then whites were dependent on Native peoples to teach us farming skills, as our complete ineptitude in this realm left the earliest colonists starving to death and turning to cannibalism when the winters came in order to survive.

We were dependent on Mexicans to teach us how to extract gold from riverbeds and quartz--critical to the growth of the national economy in the mid to late 1800's--and had we not taken over half their nation in an unprovoked war, the emerging Pacific ports so vital to the modern U.S. economy would not have been ours, but Mexico' s. That, my friends, is dependence. Then we were dependent on their labor in the mid 20th century under the bracero program, through which over five million Mexicans were brought into the country for cheap agricultural work, and then sent back across the border.

And we were dependent on Asian labor to build the railroads that made transcontinental travel and commerce possible. 90% of the labor used to build the Central Pacific Railroad in the 1860's were Chinese, imported for the purpose, and exploited because the railroad bosses felt they could better control them than white workers.

In fact, all throughout U.S. labor history, whites have depended on the subordination of workers of color; by the marking of black and brown peoples as the bottom rung on the ladder--a rung below which they would not be allowed to fall. By virtue of this racialized class system whites could receive the "psychological wage" of whiteness, even if their real wages left them destitute. That too is dependence, and a kind that has marked even the poorest whites.

The plantation owners in the South were surely dependent on blacks, and for more than field labor. We relied on black women to suckle and care for our children. We relied on blacks to build the levees that kept rivers like the Mississippi from our doorstep. We relied on black girls to fan our sleeping white ladies so as to ensure their comfort. We relied on blacks to do everything from cooking, to cleaning, to making our beds, to polishing our shoes, to chopping the wood to heat our homes, to nursing us back to health when we fell ill. We prided ourselves on being (or aspiring to be) men and women of leisure, while black and brown folks did all the work. That, and a lot more, is dependence; and yet we still insist they are the lazy ones.

And northern industrial capitalism relied on black labor too, especially to break the labor militance of white ethnics by playing off one group of workers against the other. That also, is dependence.

During the civil war, the armies of the Confederacy relied on blacks to cook for the troops and to make the implements of war they would use in battle; and likewise, the Union relied on black soldiers--around 200,000 of them--to ultimately win the war. That too, is most assuredly dependence.

And white dependence on people of color continues to this day. Each year, African Americans spend over $500 billion with white-owned companies: money that goes mostly into the pockets of the white owners, white employees, white stockholders, and white communities in which they live. And yet we say black people need us? We think they are the dependent ones, relying as we assume they do on the paltry scraps of an eviscerated welfare state? Now let's just cut the crap. Who would be hurt more: black folks if all welfare programs were shut down tomorrow, or white folks, if blacks decided they were through transferring half-a-trillion dollars each year to white people and were going to keep their money in their own communities?

Or what about the ongoing dependence of white businesses on the exploitation of black labor? Each year, according to estimates from the Urban Institute, over $120 billion in wages are lost to African Americans thanks to discrimination in the labor market. That's money that doesn't end up in the hands of the folks who earned it, but rather remains in the bank accounts of owners. That my friends, is dependence.

Our dependence on people of color even extends to our need to have them as spokespeople for our ideologies and agendas: thus, the proliferation of high-profile conservatives of color who bash their own people for us, so we don't have to do it alone. Ken Hamblin, Clarence Thomas, Larry Elder, Walter Williams, Linda Chavez: all of them, walking, talking, lawn jockeys, shining their lights for white supremacy. And oh yes, our need for them is most certainly a form of dependence.

Then, we rely on still more people of color to help further the agenda of white dominance: namely Asians, whom we proclaim to be "model minorities." "See how hard the Asians work,' whites love to say, 'why can't blacks be more like them?" Of course, we fail to mention the staggering poverty among Southeast Asians; or the fact that the most successful Asian sub-groups came to this country with both business experience and usually college educations; or the fact that despite hard work, Asian Pacific Islanders still earn between 11-26% less than their white counterparts, even when their qualifications are equal. Never mind all that: the model minority myth has a power all its own, and is one more way in which whites have become dependent on those who are not.

Indeed, I am beginning to think that whites are so dependent on people of color that we wouldn't know what to do without them. Oh sure, some neo-Nazis say they would love to try, but in reality I doubt they could make it. If there were no black and brown folks around then whites would have no one to blame but themselves for the crime that occurred; no one to blame but themselves when they didn't get the job they wanted; no one to blame but themselves when their lives turned out to be less than they expected. In short, we need people of color--especially in a subordinate role--as a way to build ourselves up, and provide a sense of self-worth we otherwise lack.

To be sure, our very existence as white people is dependent on a negative: to be white has meaning only in terms of what it doesn't mean. To be white only has meaning in so far as it means not to be black or brown. Whiteness has no intrinsic meaning culturally: can anyone even articulate what "white culture" means? Not our various European cultures mind you--which do have meaning but have been largely lost to us in the mad dash to accept whiteness and the perks that come with it--but white culture itself.

In workshops I have asked white folks and people of color what they like about being black, white, or whatever they in fact may be. For African-Americans the answers always have to do with the pride they feel, coming from families who have struggled against the odds, fought injustice, persevered, and maintained dignity in the face of great obstacles. In other words, to be black has internal meaning, derived from the positive actions and experiences of black people themselves. Variations on the same theme tend to be expressed by Latinos, Asians and Indigenous peoples as well.

But for whites, if they come up with anything at all, it is typically something about how nice it is not to have to worry about being racially profiled by police, or how nice it is not to be presumed less competent by employers, or discriminated against when applying for a loan, or looking for a home. In other words, for whites, our self-definition is wrapped up entirely in terms of what and who we aren't. What it means to be white is merely to not be "the other." And for that to have any meaning whatsoever there first must be an "other" against which to contrast oneself.

And that is the most significant dependence of all.

Aqueous Moon
05-29-2006, 01:08 PM
^^^ It's long....but, it's a very interesting read if you have the time.

HANZO
05-29-2006, 01:32 PM
its like the english depend on eastern europeans now to do all the dirty low paid jobs in england. the english complain about how the eastern europeans will now take all the jobs. well yeah its the jobs that the english wont do. not at all a white thing, its a westerner issue. the article is mainly based on american white people. i wouldnt consider white peoples from russia or other eastern european countries as dependent on other races. i also see that the most successful nations are the ones that are dependent on their own people. japan for an example.

snapple
05-29-2006, 01:59 PM
^^word didn't know it was like that in europe....you ever see the movie a day without a mexican? same shit dudes bitch about mexicans jumpin the boarder but they're a vital part of the american economy.....racists are morons thats what it comes down too.

blackwisdom
05-29-2006, 02:00 PM
Everything goes back to its essence. Caucasian people's essence is African people and African people's essence is the universe. Good post, thanks for a white man's point of view.

Hotep

blackwisdom
05-29-2006, 02:04 PM
^^word didn't know it was like that in europe....you ever see the movie a day without a mexican? same shit dudes bitch about mexicans jumpin the boarder but they're a vital part of the american economy.....racists are morons thats what it comes down too.No doubt. Where do you think ranching and all of that came from? It's funny how a lot of things that are steriotypically "white" now was pioneered by Black and Brown people. Everything from cowboys, rock and roll, to mental elevation.

Hotep

blackwisdom
05-29-2006, 02:05 PM
.

HANZO
05-29-2006, 02:10 PM
a very good example is the migration of turkish people to western europe, everyone thinks they immigrants but this is untrue. after world war 2, countries like germany, england and france requested for turkish workers. the turks would work in the toughest jobs, and as repayment they get the countries passport and are free to live their. western europe is the home of using other peoples. they depend on everyone.

Aqueous Moon
05-29-2006, 02:46 PM
And today is memorial day....hence, the red, white and, blue. But, it pisses me off that soo many died for something soo selfish.

"During the civil war, the armies of the Confederacy relied on blacks to cook for the troops and to make the implements of war they would use in battle; and likewise, the Union relied on black soldiers--around 200,000 of them--to ultimately win the war. That too, is most assuredly dependence."

blackwisdom
05-30-2006, 10:28 AM
red white blueComes from the KMT temples representing Heru, Osir, Oset.

Hotep

Kephrem
05-30-2006, 10:49 AM
Comes from the KMT temples representing Heru, Osir, Oset.

Hotep

May I ask what specific temples you're refering to?

blackwisdom
05-30-2006, 12:28 PM
May I ask what specific temples you're refering to?Yes I'll have to do some digging cause I'm regurgitating from a lecture from Kwesi. I'm off to the library to prepare for a test. I'll get back to you.

Hotep

mate2006
05-30-2006, 10:18 PM
This article has no point whatsoever. Where this guy says 'whites are dependent on blacks', another would say 'whites are making the most of being on top' or, 'whites are going about their business'. I mean, I am dependent on oxygen. So fucking what? If it's so bad, then maybe coloured people should do something to turn the tables

The bit at the end of his workshops where he's asked people what they most like about being white/black. what a fucking load of bullshit. why not ask what they most like about being whatever nationality they are. not what skin colour. People he asked who where white obviously answered banal shit like 'i dont get stopped by police', because being WHITE in itself, has no fucking meaning. this he says in the article, but it does not mean that races or nationalities who are white won't have anything to be proud of.

Idiots who keep playing up the significance of skin colour are the perpetuators of a cruel, nasty world.

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 10:46 PM
I would say that the article was putting this situation in delicate words.

Because, "white dependence" is really more like white predatory blood - sucking.

And it is nothing at all like breathing, at least for those of us who are civilized.

denaturat
05-30-2006, 11:17 PM
2 wrongs don't make a right

well said

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 11:18 PM
your seriously the most racist person on this site Aqua...hands down. I'm just expressing my opinion, but everytime I see u post you always resort back to "white man this" and "white man that", and u always refer to The sun, "Blackman, woman and child, etc as being whole. why not just say man woman and child in general? Spouting racism is wrong on both sides, 2 wrongs don't make a right. I am not speaking about any post in general, nor in this topic, and yes u do have the right to your opinion. You say you speak about facts and truth in the posts u make and in a sense "express yourself as a strong black woman" but instead of truth, all I've learned from your character in your posts is you're a hateful, closed minded self pitied human being, and to an extent hypocritical. You say you speak truth, all I see is hatred. I'm not hating, I'm just expressing, maybe consider using a more positive outlook on things instead of resorting back to racism with everything u speak of, otherwise your no better than a supremecist, and from one perspective an attention craver. Thats all I gotta say, peace

Geeez.....don't kill the messenger!

I know the truth hurts.

But, let's keep the personal b.s. in check, k?

And for the umpteenth time.....I don't hate white folks!

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 11:20 PM
What's wrong about exposing the lies and illusions that keep my people mentally enslaved?

Not a thing!

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 11:24 PM
^ seriously, what makes u hate white people so much? were u beaten by one? insulted? what? because I'm white are u going to stereotype me with your mindless bullshit? And I'm not hurt, I'm feeling just fine, you seem to always be the one with the stick up your ass

Don't act like I ain't been back and forth with yo ass Pale Kris.

Ain't no need to stereotype you....you have shown me your true colors!

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 11:29 PM
as have you, like seriously, never have I ever caught feelings on the net from someone..... but you missy, have made it certain that if I EVER met u in real life, I wouldn't hesitiate to deck u in the fucking grill, and u being a girl is besides the point...

p.s: u never answered my question

What a punk ass devil thing to say....you are weird.

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 11:37 PM
I already told you....i don't hate white folks.

You are probally just feeling guilty about "white dependence" and projecting your self hatred towards me.

Try to keep it in check, k?

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 11:50 PM
yeh......thats exactly what I'm doing, your fucking remedial.....I have "1" last thing to say and perhaps it'll make some what of an impact on that useless tool on your shoulders you call a cranium

in the words of Chris Rock:

There are 2 different types of Black people, you have "black People" and u have "niggaz" I HATE NIGGAZ!

cus everytime a "black person" tries to make it in society and do well, "niggaz" got 2 fuck it up with their BULLSHIT

u fit in category #2 Aqua..........cus as I said b4, its folks like u who make white people disregard black people by posting garbage like this, and if every black person had the same mentality as you, then yes, I def. would be prejudice. And you say u don't hate white people? well u sure imply it with the crap u post on here, never have I encountered such an ignorant sack of shit, I wish nothing but bad shit to happen to u in this life and the next
done with u (4sure this time)

Big freakin deal!

If this was a white folks favorite black person contest, I would give a fuck. Get it?

And freakin buh bye! Stop saying it and just do it.

Chris Rock is a comedian...it's called a joke!
You can't be that fuckin stupid! smh

Aqueous Moon
05-30-2006, 11:59 PM
The only message I see is more "white dependence".

None of us Black folks should try to get ahead in this ass backwards society.

We should shut the system down instead.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 12:51 AM
Big freakin deal!

If this was a white folks favorite black person contest, I would give a fuck. Get it?

And freakin buh bye! Stop saying it and just do it.

Chris Rock is a comedian...it's called a joke!
You can't be that fuckin stupid! smh

Bill Hicks was also a comedian... his stuff went beyond humour, and so does Chris Rock.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 12:52 AM
The only message I see is more "white dependence".

None of us Black folks should try to get ahead in this ass backwards society.

We should shut the system down instead.

yeah, and end up like you. LOL.

Aqueous Moon
05-31-2006, 12:54 AM
Bill Hicks was also a comedian... his stuff went beyond humour, and so does Chris Rock.

Chris Rock says the shit that makes white folks quote him on forums and give him lots of dollars.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 04:43 PM
Chris Rock says the shit that makes white folks quote him on forums and give him lots of dollars.

i think you are paranoid. lay off the hydro for 2 minutes

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 05:41 PM
I guess the WHITE man that wrote this is racist too...

mate2006
05-31-2006, 05:45 PM
Your Sig Makes Me Sick.

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 05:50 PM
Your Sig Makes Me Sick.You vomit at the sight of
BEAUTIFUL BLACK BABIES???

Iron Fist
05-31-2006, 06:10 PM
If you ask me races aren't responsible for anything. The only cause of any trouble is money and power. If a black had the power and the money he'd be as immoral as a white with the power and the money (just an example ; I'm not saying blacks don't have power.)

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 06:23 PM
If you ask me races aren't responsible for anything. The only cause of any trouble is money and power. If a black had the power and the money he'd be as immoral as a white with the power and the money (just an example ; I'm not saying blacks don't have power.)I beg to differ due to the fact that for HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF YEARS Afrikans governed the planet and we only spread prosperous civilization.

Civilization - to live civil

Civil - peace

Peaceful living

It was when the Caucasian powers took hold that the corruption took hold. I can break it down genetically if you like.

One of the most basic substances in mammals (and the universe as a whole) is melanin. It is a perfect conductor of energies. It links all energies (I can take it deep). With a lack of abundance of eumelanin and and abundance of pheomelanin especially neuromelanin the universal (spiritual) connection is fragmented. Every human has both types but 'some' humans have more of either. Due to the lack of 'eu' a lack of spirituality follows. Do some research and I promise you that you'll find a whole lot of the same. Pure science. About 50-75,000 years ago you saw no hue less than a brown tent. After which study the down slope of 'humanity.'

Hotep

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 06:26 PM
Your Sig Makes Me Sick.Well do Beautiful Black Babies make you sick or am I misunderstanding?

Killer Falcon
05-31-2006, 06:28 PM
i found that a very interesting article, thanks for posting that. i don't see why your getting so pissed off b-hop, if you understood the article you whould realise you aren't doing anything but projecting your own hatred. stay humble and don't let it hit a nerve, if you disagree with it why the impulse to stress about it?

peace

mate2006
05-31-2006, 06:34 PM
Well do Beautiful Black Babies make you sick or am I misunderstanding?

I don't have any problem at all with the baby.
It's the cornyness of 'Click on The Beautiful Black Baby' that makes me want to vomit.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 06:35 PM
whats this shit about melanin being a basic substance of the universe. how the fuck do you know that. i kinda thought it was atoms and electrons etc...

mate2006
05-31-2006, 06:43 PM
The only cause of any trouble is money and power.

...And people who divide us into black and white.

snapple
05-31-2006, 06:51 PM
...And people who divide us into black and white.

exactly...it's 2006 and america is far from a melting pot....it actually annoys me when dudes preach about NAH FUCK THAT WE THE ORIGINAL MAN 800000BILLION YEARS AGO THIS AND THAT yea yea big fuckin deal fuck history man we're living right now gotta worry about whats going on today, we have to help fix the ghettos cause the government doesnt give a fuck.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 06:57 PM
exactly...it's 2006 and america is far from a melting pot....it actually annoys me when dudes preach about NAH FUCK THAT WE THE ORIGINAL MAN 800000BILLION YEARS AGO THIS AND THAT yea yea big fuckin deal fuck history man we're living right now gotta worry about whats going on today, we have to help fix the ghettos cause the government doesnt give a fuck.


thank you. Look at the thread title 'White Dependency'. very vague. very suggestive of Aqueous Moon's racism also. If you read all the garbage that these people are posting on here, you'll notice that you won't find anything on the real issue, i.e. What we as a race of human beings have to do in this day and age, i.e. TODAY, to plug the hole in the bottom of the boat which is leaking away our freedom, democracy, human rights, etc.

Fuck all this 'ORIGINAL MAN' bullshit. the original man was a monkey. If you do not believe in evolution the you are a moron.

'melanin' the basic structure of the universe. ROFLMAO

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 07:21 PM
whats this shit about melanin being a basic substance of the universe. how the fuck do you know that. i kinda thought it was atoms and electrons etc...Read a book sometime. Have you ever heard of subatomic particles? So atoms aren't the basic substance. Emperical science gives you this viewpoint because it can't explain what it can't see or relate to in a test tube of on a dish. Melanin is a common molecule in all life forms and substances in the universe. It's in the nebula of a star, clouds, sea water, soil, etc. It's an antioxident, semi/super conductor of electricity, the reason your neurons fire off, the substance that forms your con-science. Pheomelanin is a weak assimulation of eumelanin. Why do white people get sun burned, why do white people suffer from parkinson's, alzheimer's, tay sachs, etc more. Read a book and get some knowledge before you try to curse. Get the basics down first.

As far as my signature. Please don't click it because the knowledge that the Elder speaks of may increase your stupidity.

"Never speak to fools cause they scorn the wisdom of your words."
-Nasir Jones

Iron Fist
05-31-2006, 07:22 PM
Lol @ melanin the basic structure of the universe.

Yup the guy that started the thread is only a white hater, consequently a racist IMO.

God we're all the same. We all have dicks or vaginas (or both?). Fuck the color. So what if some people have bigger lips and are dark. So what if some people are pale and look like vampires. So what if the minority have red hair (I have).

Iron Fist
05-31-2006, 07:25 PM
Read a book sometime. Have you ever heard of subatomic particles? So atoms aren't the basic substance. Emperical science gives you this viewpoint because it can't explain what it can't see or relate to in a test tube of on a dish. Melanin is a common molecule in all life forms and substances in the universe. It's in the nebula of a star, clouds, sea water, soil, etc. It's an antioxident, semi/super conductor of electricity, the reason your neurons fire off, the substance that forms your con-science. Pheomelanin is a weak assimulation of eumelanin. Why do white people get sun burned, why do white people suffer from parkinson's, alzheimer's, tay sachs, etc more. Read a book and get some knowledge before you try to curse. Get the basics down first.

As far as my signature. Please don't click it because the knowledge that the Elder speaks of may increase your stupidity.

"Never speak to fools cause they scorn the wisdom of your words."
-Nasir Jones
How come every chemistry teacher in Québec (Canada) don't know about this. How come we're taught that the basic structure of everything is the atom ? How come I often see TV documentaries saying this also ?

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 07:27 PM
thank you. Look at the thread title 'White Dependency'. very vague. very suggestive of Aqueous Moon's racism also. If you read all the garbage that these people are posting on here, you'll notice that you won't find anything on the real issue, i.e. What we as a race of human beings have to do in this day and age, i.e. TODAY, to plug the hole in the bottom of the boat which is leaking away our freedom, democracy, human rights, etc.

Fuck all this 'ORIGINAL MAN' bullshit. the original man was a monkey. If you do not believe in evolution the you are a moron.

'melanin' the basic structure of the universe. ROFLMAOSankofa.
You're a monkey not I.
Laugh. If a nation does not administer it's own science it will be a slave to whoever gives it it's science.

I'm a slave to no one. A computer screen hardly defines a man. Go ahead and play the role of a fool.

As long as I stay Hotep

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 07:34 PM
Lol @ melanin the basic structure of the universe.

Yup the guy that started the thread is only a white hater, consequently a racist IMO.

God we're all the same. We all have dicks or vaginas (or both?). Fuck the color. So what if some people have bigger lips and are dark. So what if some people are pale and look like vampires. So what if the minority have red hair (I have).When I speak of melanin your western trained mind automatically regresses to the thought of skin color. I am not referring to this aspect of this "Fine Substance." I am speaking of it's actual functions in nature. If you argue with simple science you play the role of an ignorant fool. I'm not even stating inferiority but you're already being so defensive. This is why my college teachers aren't teaching this information. I explained parkinson's disease to them because their fear of blackness won't allow them to see the truth. Africans knew all of this before knowing what a white man was. I guess they were racist too huh? Have faith in your western ways. Feel free, this is a free country right?

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 07:41 PM
How come every chemistry teacher in Québec (Canada) don't know about this. How come we're taught that the basic structure of everything is the atom ? How come I often see TV documentaries saying this also ?Don't ask me. Canada's science is emperical right? If the scientist can't observe it it doesn't exist. Ethiopian priests hold a lot of the keys to this 'science.' European scientists will never understand because their bodies can't receive the 'science.' It just looks fancy just like the Dogan were dancing the course of the stars for thousands of years when Westerners thought they were doing strange dances. I guess they were racist too though.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 08:27 PM
Read a book sometime. Have you ever heard of subatomic particles? So atoms aren't the basic substance. Emperical science gives you this viewpoint because it can't explain what it can't see or relate to in a test tube of on a dish. Melanin is a common molecule in all life forms and substances in the universe. It's in the nebula of a star, clouds, sea water, soil, etc. It's an antioxident, semi/super conductor of electricity, the reason your neurons fire off, the substance that forms your con-science. Pheomelanin is a weak assimulation of eumelanin. Why do white people get sun burned, why do white people suffer from parkinson's, alzheimer's, tay sachs, etc more. Read a book and get some knowledge before you try to curse. Get the basics down first.

As far as my signature. Please don't click it because the knowledge that the Elder speaks of may increase your stupidity.

"Never speak to fools cause they scorn the wisdom of your words."
-Nasir Jones

I know atoms are not the smallest molecule. I never said they were. I just didn't remember being taught anything about melanin at school, that's all.

I'm white. I don't burn in the sun, I tan.

I read books thank you very much, maybe i'll go read up on melanin, see if you are full of shit or not.

Iron Fist
05-31-2006, 09:11 PM
I know atoms are not the smallest molecule. I never said they were. I just didn't remember being taught anything about melanin at school, that's all.

I'm white. I don't burn in the sun, I tan.

I read books thank you very much, maybe i'll go read up on melanin, see if you are full of shit or not.
Well the electron IS the smallest particle

Iron Fist
05-31-2006, 09:13 PM
Melanin according to wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melanin)

Iron Fist
05-31-2006, 09:15 PM
Don't ask me. Canada's science is emperical right? If the scientist can't observe it it doesn't exist. Ethiopian priests hold a lot of the keys to this 'science.' European scientists will never understand because their bodies can't receive the 'science.' It just looks fancy just like the Dogan were dancing the course of the stars for thousands of years when Westerners thought they were doing strange dances. I guess they were racist too though.
Ethiopian priests ?? This is your proof ? Ok. Don't believe me if I say I trust you.

Aqueous Moon
05-31-2006, 09:19 PM
http://suzar.com/BOTW/BOTW-ch5b-pages55-56.html

This link has information about melanin that would be more beneficial to understanding what is being said here.

TAURO
05-31-2006, 09:25 PM
After reading all these threads about who is more superior racially I've come to my own conclusion, HUMAN NATURE, we as humans are incapable of fully accepting one another as equals, I doubt racism will ever go away completly. Mankind currently is weak mentally, the fact that we as the dominant species on this planet is unable to overlook such a pettie thing as skin color proves this.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 09:27 PM
After reading all these threads about who is more superior racially I've come to my own conclusion, HUMAN NATURE, we as humans are incapable of fully accepting one another as equals, I doubt racism will ever go away completly. Mankind currently is weak mentally, the fact that we as the dominant species on this planet is unable to overlook such a pettie thing as skin color proves this.

yeah and i was considering skin colour a lot less before i came on this forum and read Aqueous Moon's grabage. poison i tell you.

Aqueous Moon
05-31-2006, 09:35 PM
After reading all these threads about who is more superior racially I've come to my own conclusion, HUMAN NATURE, we as humans are incapable of fully accepting one another as equals, I doubt racism will ever go away completly. Mankind currently is weak mentally, the fact that we as the dominant species on this planet is unable to overlook such a pettie thing as skin color proves this.

That's what they want you to think.

While they continue to fuck over indigineous people all over the planet. And killing and starving little children and women.

They continue to keep the money and power in they little white hands....while you talking about some skin color don't matter.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 09:37 PM
they little white hands...

this is clear contempt towards white people. you are a racist cow. i really wish you would shut the fuck up.

Aqueous Moon
05-31-2006, 09:39 PM
this is clear contempt towards white people. you are a racist cow. i really wish you would shut the fuck up.

Keep wishing.

Don't hold your breath.

TeknicelStylez
05-31-2006, 09:47 PM
You people crack me up yo, why you clinging to your races for, the only way you would feel inferior to another race is if you were trying to be superior. If you take it as she's trying to say the black man is better than you, and you are offended than it's obvious he is. If she calls you a white devil and you get offended deep down inside, than you obviously are. If she claims the black man was the original man and the father of civilization, which is very obvious, and you get upset than it's very obvious you got some of your own race issues to work out. Do the math, look at the condition of the earth today, look who's in power, who do you think the white devils are? If you think we're talking about you and you want to get upset and slang insults at black/brown people than it's obvious that you belong in the same boat as them.

mate2006
05-31-2006, 09:47 PM
Keep wishing.

Don't hold your breath.

you don't even try to deny that you are a racist.

i am curious as to your background.

what sort of employment are you in?

just wondering what spawned you

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 09:49 PM
http://suzar.com/BOTW/BOTW-ch5b-pages55-56.html

This link has information about melanin that would be more beneficial to understanding what is being said here.Good link. Brother our fight isn't with trying to convince non-Blacks of our greatness because it's not practical to them. Our goal is to build with our own so that we can take the same strong stances that China and Japan are taking. Who cares if white people know about themselves. If they were to study their history at face value in comparison to ours they would really hold their heads down. Lets build up our own Nation and press on. Take a lesson from Brother El Hajj Malik.

Hotep

Aqueous Moon
05-31-2006, 09:56 PM
Good link. Brother our fight isn't with trying to convince non-Blacks of our greatness because it's not practical to them. Our goal is to build with our own so that we can take the same strong stances that China and Japan are taking. Who cares if white people know about themselves. If they were to study their history at face value in comparison to ours they would really hold their heads down. Lets build up our own Nation and press on. Take a lesson from Brother El Hajj Malik.

Hotep

Peace

This is truth...

words of wisdom.

denaturat
05-31-2006, 09:56 PM
Good link. Brother our fight isn't with trying to convince non-Blacks of our greatness because it's not practical to them. Our goal is to build with our own so that we can take the same strong stances that China and Japan are taking. Who cares if white people know about themselves. If they were to study their history at face value in comparison to ours they would really hold their heads down. Lets build up our own Nation and press on. Take a lesson from Brother El Hajj Malik.

Hotep

don't lump all white people together in one group. not all were historically "masters" and opressors.

blackwisdom
05-31-2006, 10:18 PM
don't lump all white people together in one group. not all were historically "masters" and opressors.I'm saying this in the context that it's useless to teach caucasian people KMT 'Fine Stuff' knowledge.

There is a distinct difference between African and caucasian people pass the skin. Do I judge people by that... no I don't. Just ask someone I know.

I do understand that I can't share all of my info with everyone because knowledge is only useful if you can use it.

Every ethnicity has suffered atrocities.

I just see what I need to do to uplift mines cause if I don't I can't expect anyone else to do it for me.

Aqueous Moon
05-31-2006, 10:21 PM
You people crack me up yo, why you clinging to your races for, the only way you would feel inferior to another race is if you were trying to be superior. If you take it as she's trying to say the black man is better than you, and you are offended than it's obvious he is. If she calls you a white devil and you get offended deep down inside, than you obviously are. If she claims the black man was the original man and the father of civilization, which is very obvious, and you get upset than it's very obvious you got some of your own race issues to work out. Do the math, look at the condition of the earth today, look who's in power, who do you think the white devils are? If you think we're talking about you and you want to get upset and slang insults at black/brown people than it's obvious that you belong in the same boat as them.

nice post, tek.

denaturat
05-31-2006, 10:30 PM
I'm saying this in the context that it's useless to teach caucasian people KMT 'Fine Stuff' knowledge.

There is a distinct difference between African and caucasian people pass the skin. Do I judge people by that... no I don't. Just ask someone I know.

I do understand that I can't share all of my info with everyone because knowledge is only useful if you can use it.

Every ethnicity has suffered atrocities.

I just see what I need to do to uplift mines cause if I don't I can't expect anyone else to do it for me.

I was refering to what you said about white people holding their heads down. many white people have nothing to be ashamed of vis-a-vis black people, becasue either their generation had nothing to do with oppression, or because their culture had nothing do with oprressing anyone other than the poor people of their own nation

TeknicelStylez
05-31-2006, 10:36 PM
other than the poor people of their own nation

who makes up the majority of the poor?

denaturat
05-31-2006, 10:41 PM
who makes up the majority of the poor?

read my above posts. i was not refering to north america or western europe. most of the poor people in lithuania are lithuanian, and most of the poor in unkraine are unkrainians, to name a few countries for example.

Kephrem
06-01-2006, 04:43 AM
read my above posts. i was not refering to north america or western europe. most of the poor people in lithuania are lithuanian, and most of the poor in unkraine are unkrainians, to name a few countries for example.


Why did you have to go deep into Europe to prove that all so-called white people did not play a shameful part within so-called black history? It's Europe in general and so-called white people in particular representing Europe as a geograpohic location within a specific time period (spanning several centuries culminating with institutionalized "racism" or rather opression) who are to blame for those recorded atrocities, therefore any attempts to trivilaize that by bringing up small states within the whole of Europe shows intellectual cowardice in owning up to said history.

TeknicelStylez
06-01-2006, 07:39 AM
read my above posts. i was not refering to north america or western europe. most of the poor people in lithuania are lithuanian, and most of the poor in unkraine are unkrainians, to name a few countries for example.

If you wanna get global about it, whats the most and impovershed and disease ridden war torn continent?

HANZO
06-01-2006, 08:53 AM
If you wanna get global about it, whats the most and impovershed and disease ridden war torn continent?

africa??
why is it like that, and why isnt north africa (egypt, morroco etc etc) improverished and disease ridden. surely if the black man had god like suprerior powers then they wouldnt be in this situation. lets get real people, basing your civilizations history and future on mythical sources and statements isnt gonna get you any credit. because nations like france, england and spain have oppressed peoples of africa doesnt mean you gotta hate all white people, and generalise all as being 'devils'

Kephrem
06-01-2006, 09:33 AM
because nations like france, england and spain have oppressed peoples of africa doesnt mean you gotta hate all white people, and generalise all as being 'devils

You do realize that you've promptly named three of the most powerful states (with America also spawning from England) to rule the world within the last 500 years, right?

And to get an even more accurate picture, let's also throw in that group the Portugese, the Dutch, and the Germans. Shall we then continue to go more south (and east) to further highlight those Europeans lack of remorse not only in their historical oppression but with the wholesale murder (and later its acceptance vis-a-vis Manifest Destiny) of the darker people of the earth?

UNCLE RUCKUS
06-01-2006, 10:42 AM
Peace
Turks are Europeans too and are also not to be trusted. No disrespect intended, but why don´t people start accepting the past (and god forbid apologising for it). As deep as you search you will discover more and more of a diabolic past. The present and the future however are the important. A legacy of blood must never be forgotten but your babies musn´t learn the same hate and lies as we have all been taught in their institutions. I wish no ill will towards none of my brethren on this site. Stop the continuous denial of fact; whether it be a product of inner-self- hate and/or guilt of past/present actions.

HANZO
06-01-2006, 01:18 PM
Peace
Turks are Europeans too and are also not to be trusted. No disrespect intended, but why don´t people start accepting the past (and god forbid apologising for it). As deep as you search you will discover more and more of a diabolic past. The present and the future however are the important. A legacy of blood must never be forgotten but your babies musn´t learn the same hate and lies as we have all been taught in their institutions. I wish no ill will towards none of my brethren on this site. Stop the continuous denial of fact; whether it be a product of inner-self- hate and/or guilt of past/present actions.

we aint european at all. turks just conquered the balkans. mainland turkey is in asia. turks decend form central asia. no where near europe. the turks like many empires where imperialistic, but turks had no where near the same aggression as seen by the western european. we only invaded north africa, reason why because the sultans wanted muslims to be under one nation. they had no intention of going south. also the turks didnt sail to america like every other state. this ofcourse gave them a great disadvantage and was the reason for the decline of the empire, but turks didnt have the same greed as the westerners. but this was old turks we talking 500 years ago when they were honourable people. but thats a different story.

You do realize that you've promptly named three of the most powerful states (with America also spawning from England) to rule the world within the last 500 years, right?

yes i do realise reason why i choose to name these nations. these are three nations you should target your ammo at. they were the ones who were most ruthless toward black people. and even worse towards the native indians.

And to get an even more accurate picture, let's also throw in that group the Portugese, the Dutch, and the Germans. Shall we then continue to go more south (and east) to further highlight those Europeans lack of remorse not only in their historical oppression but with the wholesale murder (and later its acceptance vis-a-vis Manifest Destiny) of the darker people of the earth?

name me one eastern european state that commited atrocities to peoples with darker skin, or a balkan state.
Apart from the soviets who didnt really care about skin colour. and the serbians who just wanted to kill muslims.

Kephrem
06-01-2006, 02:24 PM
yes i do realise reason why i choose to name these nations. these are three nations you should target your ammo at.

I don't choose to "aim my ammo" just on them. This is why I threw Germany, the Dutch and the Portugese into the line of fire.

they were the ones who were most ruthless toward black people. and even worse towards the native indians.

Murder is murder, and slavery is slavery, and benefitting off of these crimes makes one just as guilty as the perpatrators. If those states were the trinity of ruthlesness, the white people from Eastern Europe, Scotland, Ireland, etc., who subsequently settled America were co-conspirators and accessories to those crimes.


name me one eastern european state that commited atrocities to peoples with darker skin, or a balkan state.

I'll quote myself replying to denaturat from earlier:


Why did you have to go deep into Europe to prove that all so-called white people did not play a shameful part within so-called black history? It's Europe in general and so-called white people in particular representing Europe as a geograpohic location within a specific time period (spanning several centuries culminating with institutionalized "racism" or rather opression) who are to blame for those recorded atrocities, therefore any attempts to trivilaize that by bringing up small states within the whole of Europe shows intellectual cowardice in owning up to said history.

name me one eastern european state that commited atrocities to peoples with darker skin,

Lets not play semantics, Europe is, and will always be, Europe, and the concepts of Eastern vs. Western Europe wasn't based on anything but politics.

As a term, the origins of "Eastern Europe" are fairly recent. For many years serfdom and reactionary autocratic governments persisted long after those things faded in the West. It was always a very vague notion

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Europe



Apart from the soviets who didnt really care about skin colour. and the serbians who just wanted to kill muslims.

If the Russians didn't care about "skin color" why did they mock their greatest writer, Alexander Pushkin, regarding his?

http://www.best.uni-mainz.de/modules/AMS/article.php?storyid=53

HANZO
06-01-2006, 04:43 PM
Lets not play semantics, Europe is, and will always be, Europe, and the concepts of Eastern vs. Western Europe wasn't based on anything but politics.

europe is just the name of a continent, just as asia is the name of another. the nations inside europe have very different lifestyles. this has been since the wars between rome and the barbarians.

If the Russians didn't care about "skin color" why did they mock their greatest writer, Alexander Pushkin, regarding his?

russians although may be seen as a prodominatly caucasian nation, it is not, look at the east of the country and siberia. mongoloid peoples are the main population. but in russia the many cultures are segregated.
also a reason why i stated that the russians wouldnt care about the skin colour is that the country has a very low black population. some may have never seen a black person in their life. because of this their views of peoples with different colours wouldnt be accurate because they know very little about them. i know for a fact this is true, cause i have family members in turkey who have never seen a black person in their life. they dont have an opinion on them, some may have an opinion but it comes from outer sources as stereotypical views on other races, basically what they are told or hear. the same goes for russians.

LHX
06-01-2006, 05:04 PM
PLEASE TO BE REFERRING TO THE SKIN COLOR THREAD TO CONTINUE THIS DISCUSSION

although it seems like this thread started off with some good shit