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UNCLE RUCKUS
07-20-2006, 06:16 AM
I found this interesting check it out; from www.africaresource.com (http://www.africaresource.com)

The Fomorians
There are many oblique references to the presence of Black people in ancient Ireland. Ancient Irish mythology refers to the original inhabitants of the island as being a giant, sea-faring people called the Fomorians (Fomors), which means “dark of the sea”. According to the ancient lore, they were a cushitic people from the African continent. Often depicted as demons, they defeated the first few incoming waves of invaders, but could not defeat the Firbolgs, who settled the land and lived side-by-side with the native Fomors.
Those myths may have a factual historical basis. It is proposed that the Formorians were a real people who were in all likelihood sailors from the African continent.
Two more invasions, the first led by the godly Tuatha de Danaan, and the second by the Celtic Milesians, took control of Ireland, mixing together with the Fomorians until they were no more.
There are credible sources for the African association with Ireland. The most likely of these is that they were Phoenicians and/or Egyptians. The Phoenicians were Canaanites, which came from the line of Ham. Ham is the mythological ancestor of the Black nation.
The Phoenicians were also well-known for their sailing skills, and are said to have traveled to the British Isles, which they called the “Tin Islands”. Perhaps, before Ireland was a Celtic domain, which it wasn’t until a few centuries BCE, the Phoenicians colonized it. It is noteworthy that the name Fomorians sounds a bit like Phoenicians.
There is also a legend that an Egyptian princess, Scota, left Egypt with some followers and journeyed to Ireland. Legend has it that Egyptians left many ancient tin mines all over Britain but especially Ireland which was their major source of the valuable metal.
Another idea is that they were Taureg Berbers. The Berber language is Hamitic, and the Berber people live in an area from which travel to Ireland would be easily accessible. The Berbers perhaps set sail from western Morocco, and settled on Ireland before the Celts, making it their new home (http://www.srch-results.com/lm/rtl3.asp?si=19902&k=new%20home).
Moorish Science Temple founder Drew Ali teaches that Ireland was once part of a Moorish empire, and that the Irish are a Moorish people. Perhaps there is a common root between the “moor” sound in Fomor and the word Moor?

Selkies and Half-Breeds
Another Irish legend tells of the Selkies, a sort-of “wereseal” that is a seal during day, but a human by nightfall. Sometimes, in an Irish family of fair-skinned, light-haired people, a child is born with dark hair eyes, and skin, and is called a Selkie.
The concept of the Selkies appears to make subliminal reference to the half-breed children that resulted from the extensive miscegenation that occurred between the Celts and the dark skinned original inhabitants that they had met upon their arrival in Ireland.
Many people of Irish descent have distant and recent African roots, and these features can still be seen in the people and in the culture. There are some Irish people with Afros (just like Andre the Giant a late continental European wrestler with afro-hair). In Southern Ireland, some people, referred to as “Black Irish”, are noted for their strikingly dark features, as opposed to the fair-skinned, light-haired north.
Although many Irish descendants are particularly pale, they do have pronounced Africoid facial features (http://www.srch-results.com/lm/rtl3.asp?si=19902&k=facial%20features), as well as dark brown eyes, and dark brown hair that is sort-of kinky, especially in moist conditions. A sub race of the Irish called the Bronn are noticeably Mediterranean (read: African) in features especially their hair.
In addition to all of this, Celtic music is distinctly different from the rest of Europe, and easily comparable to African music.

Black, Viking and Irish
Unlike Scotland and England, Ireland was never colonized by the Romans. As a result, Ireland remained relatively isolated.
The Vikings established port cities like Dublin. The Viking texts left stories and descriptions of African soldiers captured in Ireland whom they called blaumen.
Most Viking references to ‘’black'’ in Norse would have signified having black hair as opposed to skin color but blaumen meant black skinned. Most of these blaumen were captured soliders from Moorish Spain. It was observed that:
”A prominent Viking of the eleventh century was Thorhall, who was aboard the ship that carried the early Vikings to the shores of North America. Thorhall was “the huntsman in summer, and in winter the steward of Eric the Red. He was, it is said, a large man, and strong, black, and like a giant, silent, and foul-mouthed in his speech, and always egged on Eric to the worst; he was a bad Christian.”"
“Another Viking, more notable than Thorhall, was Earl Thorfinn, “the most distinguished of all the earls in the Islands.” Thorfinn ruled over nine earldoms in Scotland and Ireland, and died at the age of seventy-five. His widow married the king of Scotland. Thorfinn was described as “one of the largest men in point of stature, and ugly, sharp featured, and somewhat tawny, and the most martial looking man… It has been related that he was the foremost of all his men.”"
[B]
What about Scotland and Wales?
“Any comprehensive account of the African presence in early Europe should include England, Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Scandinavia. The history and legends of Scotland confirm the existence of “purely Black people.” We see one of them in the person of Kenneth the Niger. During the tenth century Kenneth the Niger ruled over three provinces in the Scottish Highlands.
The historical and literary traditions of Wales reflect similar beliefs. According to Gwyn Jones (perhaps the world’s leading authority on the subject), to the Welsh chroniclers, “The Danes coming in by way of England and the Norwegians by way of Ireland were pretty well all black: Black Gentiles, Black Norsemen, Black Host.”"
Ogu Eji Ofo Annu



We all know the Irish are drastically different from Europeans and it is unfair to include them in that category.

Ultimate Fist
07-20-2006, 10:40 PM
Thank you for this info. I've suspected this for a long time. In America, the Irish have always been treated more poorly than other "European" groups. We were called Irish dogs in the 1800s and treated as second class citizens. Supposedly, America started considering us white in the 1900s but I don't believe it. A lot of us still live in trailer parks. The whole "redneck" stereotype is an updating of the Irish dog stereotype.

IRISH DOGS-Drunk, violent, wife beater, unsophisticated
REDNECK-Drunk, violent, wife beater, unsophisticated

The whole thing's racism. And I've known we aren't white for a long time. Just because you live in Europe doesn't make you white. Its interesting to think we might be blacks. We are a lot like blacks. We listen to the same music, are associated with violence in the media and are really spiritual.

Peace.

Koolish
07-20-2006, 11:19 PM
why is it that being african or having african roots is such an amazing discovery, we fucking started out in africa no shit that there's gonna be evidence of dark-skinned people inhabiting the earth.

wow you're black! you're amazing!

fuck what race you are, be proud of who you are.

CULTURE>RACE

the more you single out races and refer to them in seperate categories than others the more racism is fueled.

i might be one of the few people who care about the human race, your skin colour means shit to me.

Kephrem
07-20-2006, 11:31 PM
@ Koolish, I'm pretty sure the original post was not alluding to people descended of Africans from some 10-20,000 years ago (as that theory goes), but to fairly recent history.

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-21-2006, 04:19 AM
@ Koolish, I'm pretty sure the original post was not alluding to people descended of Africans from some 10-20,000 years ago (as that theory goes), but to fairly recent history.

Yeah exactly; and I dont think it is common knowledge that Afrikans were in Ireland before the Viking, Norman, or British invaders.

CHRONZ
07-21-2006, 04:34 AM
Co sign ! ^O^

why is it that being african or having african roots is such an amazing discovery, we fucking started out in africa no shit that there's gonna be evidence of dark-skinned people inhabiting the earth.

wow you're black! you're amazing!

fuck what race you are, be proud of who you are.

CULTURE>RACE

the more you single out races and refer to them in seperate categories than others the more racism is fueled.

i might be one of the few people who care about the human race, your skin colour means shit to me.

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-21-2006, 05:29 AM
why is it that being african or having african roots is such an amazing discovery, we fucking started out in africa no shit that there's gonna be evidence of dark-skinned people inhabiting the earth.

wow you're black! you're amazing!

fuck what race you are, be proud of who you are.

CULTURE>RACE

the more you single out races and refer to them in seperate categories than others the more racism is fueled.

i might be one of the few people who care about the human race, your skin colour means shit to me.

My intention was not to fuel racism; I don´t see where you got that from. I don´t agree with you saying "fuck what race you are" because people need to understand their culture/roots to know themselves. I do agree that you should "be proud of who you are" and I think that knowing your roots is part of that. I think race/culture are often one and the same thing.
RESPECT TO ALL YOU

"If you don´t know where you came from baby; you damn sure don´t know where you going"-Poppa Wu

Wu-tang Fan
07-21-2006, 12:50 PM
We all know the Irish are drastically different from Europeans and it is unfair to include them in that category.

Why would it be unfair? There is nothing bad about being European:tease:

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-21-2006, 01:00 PM
Why would it be unfair? There is nothing bad about being European:tease:

I have nothing against euros on a personal basis; I just dont think the Irish belong in that category.

whitey
07-21-2006, 02:30 PM
ooOOOoo so thats why when the Irish came to America they were called niggers.


A bad joke indeed, but they really were called that when immigrating to America.

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-21-2006, 02:35 PM
[quote=whitey]ooOOOoo so thats why when the Irish came to America they were called niggers.

^^^^^^^
Was that necessary?

Aqua Luna
07-21-2006, 03:01 PM
This is a really good thread, kwu. Very interesting info...

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-21-2006, 03:11 PM
This is a really good thread, kwu. Very interesting info...

Peace Aqua Luna

Frontal Lobotomy
07-21-2006, 04:00 PM
As an Irishman, I'm not suprised at all. My people and those of Africa have always had great affintity with one another, I figured it was because of the ay Britain had shit on us both to begin with. But I eventually found out why, its because we both enjoy a pint of guinness!
There's a Island in the caribbean, I forget the name of it, wher ethe people ther eare of African (and Irish) descent where they have dark skin, red hair and green eyes. I'll try and find out the name of the place so you don't think i'm chatting bollocks like.
But yeah, you guys my bruthas hahaha :D

Kephrem
07-21-2006, 04:13 PM
I've heard there's a small black community or at least a small black presence in Ireland, can anyone confirm this?

Frontal Lobotomy
07-21-2006, 04:23 PM
Ther was always a fair amount in Dublin, but with Ireland puttin on the facade of being hardcore catholic haters, they were kept DL. In reality that's as far from the truth as you can get. As long as you're not Enlglish, or have been in the free-state or British armed services, they'll love you.

Wu-tang Fan
07-22-2006, 06:06 AM
I've heard there's a small black community or at least a small black presence in Ireland, can anyone confirm this?

Yeah, they were the descentants of slaves left there.

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-22-2006, 06:49 AM
Yeah, they were the descentants of slaves left there.

Ahhh no.

Wu-tang Fan
07-22-2006, 06:52 PM
Yes they were. I saw it on a film where they had a slave lady washing the shoes of another lady. If you are going to disagree with something, give a reason, or you will just be considered a cunthead.

Koolish
07-22-2006, 10:38 PM
My intention was not to fuel racism; I don´t see where you got that from. I don´t agree with you saying "fuck what race you are" because people need to understand their culture/roots to know themselves. I do agree that you should "be proud of who you are" and I think that knowing your roots is part of that. I think race/culture are often one and the same thing.
RESPECT TO ALL YOU

"If you don´t know where you came from baby; you damn sure don´t know where you going"-Poppa Wu
where i'm from there's enough "black guy, white guy, spanish guy, brown guy, asian guy" style crap and that's all good for physical description. but i believe skin colour is skin deep.

and anyways i'm part irish so this information has an effect on me, but i don't really care. it's nice to know your roots but i put no more emphasis on where the irish came from than where the british/irish/german came from, which i also have in me. the information is definately interesting, but i don't see it as something that should be specially noted. like "I'm part irish and did you know historically that ireland was inhabited by black people?", people would give me a real fucked up look. what am i trying to prove?

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-23-2006, 11:44 AM
Yes they were. I saw it on a film where they had a slave lady washing the shoes of another lady. If you are going to disagree with something, give a reason, or you will just be considered a cunthead.

Just as you have not verified anything by saying "I saw it in a film"; what film, was it factual, was it a documentary, or a fictional story? You have not even given a source! Calling me a "cunthead" is just helping to discredit you. I know you surley have some guilt for getting emotional about the Irish; but most likely it was Brits in Ireland who had slaves since for hundreds of years it was the English who have oppressed the Irish.

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-23-2006, 11:48 AM
where i'm from there's enough "black guy, white guy, spanish guy, brown guy, asian guy" style crap and that's all good for physical description. but i believe skin colour is skin deep.

and anyways i'm part irish so this information has an effect on me, but i don't really care. it's nice to know your roots but i put no more emphasis on where the irish came from than where the british/irish/german came from, which i also have in me. the information is definately interesting, but i don't see it as something that should be specially noted. like "I'm part irish and did you know historically that ireland was inhabited by black people?", people would give me a real fucked up look. what am i trying to prove?

This is only information; take it as you will. It was not "specially noted"; I found it interesting as did you. And what do you care what other people think of you; if you know yourself and your past it is a great step for understanding.

Peace

Koolish
07-23-2006, 03:47 PM
alright i understand, i just don't expect history lessons online y'know, and especially in know the ledge shit is usually more than just something you may have not known.

Urban_Journalz
07-31-2006, 06:58 PM
Truth be told, I have no problems with anyone. Yes I'm Black. Yes we all started out in Africa. BUT there are some people that have a genuinely lovelier attitude for me. Me for them as well. Before I even knew that I had a Scotch-Irish grandfather, Irish, Scottish, Italian and Greek people always felt like the closer of the distant relatives that is the Human Race. Surprised am I? No. Thrilled? Yes. This not only AGAIN solidifies the fact that we're one big disfunctional family, but also that we are all, in the end, one people.

I spit this quote from The Qur'an in order to further prove my point.
"Mankind was once one nation. I diversified your colors and languages, so that ye might know one another."

Now look at it, if you hear an Irish accent, you know he or she is of Irish decent. If you hear a New York accent, you know the person is from New York in The U.S.

Bottom line....embrace your people. All of them because they are all your people.

Big up to my Irish Hooligans!!!

PEACE

UNCLE RUCKUS
07-31-2006, 07:33 PM
Peace
You are right

Kephrem
07-31-2006, 08:01 PM
J.A. Rogers wrote of the black presence in Ireland, read the book 'Nature Knows No Color Line"

V4D3R
08-01-2006, 07:20 AM
A clear evident fact that hasent been pointed out is the freckles in Ireland. They say red-heads and freckled fair people have African blood in them somewhere down the line.

UNCLE RUCKUS
08-01-2006, 08:29 AM
J.A. Rogers wrote of the black presence in Ireland, read the book 'Nature Knows No Color Line"

Yeah I would like to read that and the Sex and Race books by JA Rogers

Wu-tang Fan
08-01-2006, 11:18 AM
Are you an Italian?

Urban_Journalz
08-01-2006, 12:30 PM
I gotta check that book out myself. Sounds like a nice read.
This J.A. Rogers cat, is he all about human history?? Not that it's a bad thing, I'm just curious.

Kephrem
08-01-2006, 06:19 PM
The book itself is mainly about black history and mixing in Europe. Yes he wrote mainly about black history, he was a great historian.

BIBLIOGRAPHY -- J.A. ROGERS

1. From Superman to Man

2. As Nature Leads: an informal discussion of the reason why Negro and Caucasian are mixing in spite of opposition.

3. The Approaching Storm and How It May Be Averted.

4. The Ku Klux Sprit: a brief outline of the history of the Ku Klux Klan past and present.

5. World's Greatest Men of African Descent.

6. One Hundred Amazing Facts about the Negro: with complete shortcut to the world history of the Negro.

7. World's Greatest Men and Women of African Descent.

8. The Real Facts about Ethiopia.

9. Your History from the Beginning of Time to the Present

10. Sex and Race: Negro-Caucasian Mixing in all Ages and all Lands (3 vols.).

11. World's Great Men of Color (2 vols.).

12. Nature Knows No Color Line: research in the Negro ancestry in the white race.

13. Africa's Gift to America: the Afro-American in the making and saving of the United States with new supplement: Africa and its potentialities.

14. Facts about the Negro.

15. Five Negro Presidents


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joel_August_Rogers

Urban_Journalz
08-02-2006, 10:36 AM
Bananas yo. Thanks a lot.

Peace.