View Full Version : Did Ali invent rap?

Kenny Powers
12-06-2006, 02:10 PM
Did Ali invent rap? Espn is doing this whole big thing on him and its kinda interesting...


12-06-2006, 03:05 PM

12-06-2006, 03:24 PM
you know the deal ,its all about a dolla bill

Wu-Tang 9
12-06-2006, 04:23 PM
ali is the most overrated fighter OF ALL TIME. come talk to me if u wanna get ur shit kicked in, in that argument. and no he didnt invent rap

12-06-2006, 04:39 PM

Gil Scott Heron was one of the founding fathers. The Revolution Will Not Be Televised.

12-06-2006, 05:08 PM
no god and allah had three kid hip hop, stephen colbert, and me

if you bitches take this serosly slap you self god and allah are one and the same

12-06-2006, 05:15 PM
when i saw that ad on ESPN i immediately said, "This is the dumbest thing i've ever heard!" That is my opinion on the matter

12-06-2006, 08:19 PM
i don't mean to Son ya'll but... if yr interested in boxing get a book called

"The Devil & Sonny Liston" ** now **. It's by Nick Tosches & will bust you up regardless of who was or wasn't "the greatest."

As for the roots of rap, it goes way back. The earliest, closest approximation being folk & blues songs of the 1920s, including all kinds of gangsta shit (for the time) too.

If you guys ain't memorized the first Last Poets record (just called Last Poets) you GOTTA.

seriously, don't sleep on the Tosches, it's the hardcore shit.

maestro wooz
12-06-2006, 08:19 PM
no but that documentary looks real interesting regardless

Chief 'Broom
12-06-2006, 09:09 PM
definitely the first shit talker in sports

he did say lines like "I float like a butterfly, sting like a bee" (simple example)

similies are always used in rap "I'm a hustler, i could sell water to a whale" - Jay

anyway, if you wanna watch a proper documentary on Ali peep "When We Were Kings" - fuck Will Smith

and for the dude that said Ali was overrated, state your business

The Lost Prophet
12-06-2006, 09:58 PM
ali is the most overrated fighter OF ALL TIME. come talk to me if u wanna get ur shit kicked in, in that argument. and no he didnt invent rap

let me guess joe louis or maybe rocky marciano...............or maybe frazier, foreman, or liston......wait ali beat all three of them dudes, 2 of them he stoped cold in there prime and can someone name another fighter who left boxing for three years came back and won the title twice.............and can someone name another boxer that never got knocked out or tko......and can somone name another boxer that defeated 3 top 15 boxers of all time (if not top ten) while he was fighting............ali was the truth and u my friend r a hater..............only arguement u can make was jack johnson from the early 1900's everyone else was garbage compared to ali...........speak to any real boxing historian or anyone who has boxed and ali's name will come up every time as one of the greats and as the best................oh and marciano couldnt take a hit and louis had foot work of a 15 year old white boy who never went to public school..................oh and a wild guess, are u white? perhaps an advicator of the vietnam war?

p.s. sugar ray said ali was the best heavy weight fighter of all time

12-06-2006, 10:10 PM
nobody can front on Ali's cultural signifcance-- there were other outspoken brutha's then & before-- tho' not THAT many-- but he had the biggest stage AND... he took it.

1) i don't have it but ya'll MUST find the youtube clip w/The Champ, Sly Stone and some ofay congressman from Ohio on the Mike Douglas show-- it's before yr time but will still freak you out.

2) i hear you Prophet & it's debateable but the question of Ali v. Liston is not an easy one. Too bad Mike Tyson ain't posting here, he's got some thoughts on the matter.

seriously, ya'll need that Last Poets side (the first lp only for starters). Best Gil-Scott Heron is heavy but NOBODY in the rap game has ** ever ** come harder from the streets than those dudes. Combine peak PE, GZA & Nas... then yr close. (Even old-school heat like "The Message" & whatnot were just catching up to the Last Poets.)

12-06-2006, 10:25 PM
ah fuck, i can't find that Mike Doulgas clip-- it's insane. meanwhile, ya'll might enjoy this--


12-06-2006, 10:48 PM
People here are going off topic.......the thread starter was asking if Ali invented rap?.......simple answer is no and I suggest that the thread starter stop watching tv and do some research before starting such a retarded thread.

xHard to Earnx
12-06-2006, 10:56 PM
Thread starter wasn't asking it. He was just posting a link to the thing on ESPN. Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeez. That fact that people are actually getting into this without watching this is ridiculous.

12-06-2006, 11:03 PM
I am not gonna bother watching something I already know is bullshit, especially when it comes from such a "quality source as ESPN"

12-07-2006, 04:03 AM
I'm bad, I'm mad, and I'm the best your moms ever had!!!

And I'm pretty!!!!!

Kenny Powers
12-07-2006, 11:58 AM
People here are going off topic.......the thread starter was asking if Ali invented rap?.......simple answer is no and I suggest that the thread starter stop watching tv and do some research before starting such a retarded thread.

yeah i did my reseach and espn makes a real convincing case. You act as if espn is wikipedia and some retarded source... If they are doing a whole show on it, how is it retarded?

12-07-2006, 04:13 PM
c'mon dude-- research further. While Cassius Clay was a unique individual, he was the product of "negro" (as he was called at the time) & American culture of the time. It's great he became himself like that but there were PLENTY of models to draw from...

while his public persona blew fucking minds, all of the verbal invention, games can be found in previous music, comedy, entertainment, etc etc.

ESPN is just being provocative, OK fine, but the evidence is overwhelming against it. i don't expect many here to do it if but if ya'll listen to even hot '40s & '50s blues and r&b records, you'll hear CRAZY ass (nearly ODB-level) goofin' around. Cassius Clay need only have been familar with a little of that, + the bolder comedy of the time, to do what he did. YES, of course it was a bigger deal that a black man was doing on that stage but otherwise...

da kid toney
12-07-2006, 04:22 PM
ali g? yes!

The Lost Prophet
12-07-2006, 08:38 PM
Ali won it on 3 seperate occassions.......he along with Evander Holyfield and Lennox Lewis are the only boxers to do so......unless ofcourse u were referring to Ali when he won the title 2 more times after his prime, then my bad...

Louis the footwork of a 15yr old white boy huh? I disagree whole heartedly.....man is reagrded as prob. the greatest heavyweight of all time numerous occassions.....and I quote,

"He was the very symbol of perseverance, plodding forward, his imperious mien tracking down his prey, his indefatigable patience waiting for the chance, always punishing them with his presence. And then, he would pull the trigger, with the 2 fastest hands in the history of the heavyweight division moving almost as they did what they pleased with an intelligence all their own in a graceful exercise of power. And finally, when he had hooked his opponent, Louis, the greatest finisher in the history of boxing, would never let him get away--ask Billy Conn for references" -bert sugar

i remember a fight when marciano got knocked down three times...........wait u know what it mite have not been marciano.........fuck what that other white boxer and yea louis foot work is weak, watch his fights..............ali even explained in great fashion y louis was great but one department he lacked and that was the fact that he never moved back or the fact that he never dodged a punch he just kinda came at u like a zombie............fuck what was that fighters name and marciano had a mean left

12-07-2006, 09:14 PM
its bc of a book that came out
something like
Ali the first rapper

The Lost Prophet
12-10-2006, 03:40 PM
u might be referring to Jack Dempsey or Jimmy Braddock......

as far as the other stuff, I have seen Louis fight and yeh he didn't portray the fancy dancing of say Ali or Sugar Ray Leonard, though he came at u fierce as a mu'fucka. Unlike Frazier or Liston, Louis could adapt to being an outside boxer to an inside, which is why he is referred to as one of, if not argueably the "best" Heavyweight that ever lived.....footwork is essential, but adaptation is key.....but I hear where u coming from

yea and i totally understand the louis arguement and u agree that louis was and is better than frazier and liston but the foot work kills me..........ali was always great at adapting to the certain boxers he fought

xHard to Earnx
12-10-2006, 04:05 PM
Did any of you actually watch this? It ruled. Chuck D got old and fat. Rakim still rules.

12-10-2006, 08:14 PM
The last Poets Started Rap.

MaXiMus Da MaNtis
12-10-2006, 09:30 PM
are we talkin greastest ever or just heavywieght....cause i can arguee my case greatest ever is not even a heavyweight

12-10-2006, 09:52 PM
Gil Scott Heron

Wu-Tang 9
12-11-2006, 04:02 PM
ok, well im gna create a thread and post it in sports arena on how ali was extemly overrated. at ur request kris. we will have a friendly debate and everyone should come check it out...and yes Joe Louis last prophet...by far...look for the thread to come in the next 2 days...peace