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Visionz
12-14-2006, 12:42 AM
Is it possible that even our most inner-most convictions have been purposely directed? Meaning, do we live in such a mind-fuck of society, that even the most rebellious spirit that resides in us has come to be at the will of someone who purposely set up those conditions so that the chances of them happening any other way than the way they did was slim to none?

If that's confusing, in other words: To what extent have we been purposely directed to think the way we do?


And if by any chance could anybody suggest a link or a book that covers this subject in depth?

tekunique
12-14-2006, 01:17 AM
man.... almost everything is programmed to be percieved in a certain way... what matters is to acknowledge that and nurture your perceptions thru balance of logic. cuz no matter how much the truth is bent, the beauty of life is that to those who seek it, will find it.

Punch
12-14-2006, 01:23 AM
I'd suggest you read Doug Rushkoff's COERCION: WHY WE LISTEN TO WHAT "THEY" SAY (http://www.rushkoff.com/coercion.html).

Visionz
12-14-2006, 01:27 AM
word^ I definetly feel you on that.


The reason I ask in the first place is cuz people will be really sincere and heartfelt in wanting to help the situation of race relations but when we finally get there, maybe then collectively we'll realize it wasn't about race anyways. It's like we're purposely led down the wrong path so we spend all our time chasing our own tail.

tekunique
12-14-2006, 01:36 AM
word^ I definetly feel you on that.


The reason I ask in the first place is cuz people will be really sincere and heartfelt in wanting to help the situation of race relations but when we finally get there, maybe then collectively we'll realize it wasn't about race anyways. It's like we're purposely led down the wrong path so we spend all our time chasing our own tail.

elaborate that...

Visionz
12-14-2006, 02:01 AM
Society in general just feels so divided & KTL kinda becomes a microcosm for it. It's always a volatile issue when its brought up. There are perfectly good reason for why its a legitimate thing to discuss but the discussion only goes skin keep (pun not intended) in terms of subject matter. Yes, there was slavery in America for 400 years, yes it was fucked up and the repercussions still echo on today. The thing that's often left out, though, is that it happened in the first place, not because of skin color but because of exploitation. The europeans would have just as soon turned all the natives here into slaves but they had no immunity built up to the disease and hence were alot less reliable as slaves.




Blacks on the other hand, had already built up the immunity long ago and could work in a field all day without that southern heat fuckin w/ him. So, first and foremost, the decision to use africans for slaves wasn't personal, it was economics. And who where the only people to own slaves?, rich, white landowners. The same people who own corporations today would've had a 100 slaves in their field 200 years ago. They inflicted alot of horrible abuse on 'em to try & break their spirit but at the same time it was ingrained in the poor whites that they were somehow superior. The seed was set for all this bickering along time ago. In reality it just seems like no matter what happens there'll be something to drum opposition to each other and within each other, to keep us confused and at each other throats because they couldn't stand for a slaves uprisal like they did back in the days. There's too many of us out there for 'em to survive the onslaught.

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 02:03 AM
purposely directed to think


Why be directed to think?

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 02:06 AM
there'll be opposition to each other and within each other.

Why have opposition, what's really is opposition?

Visionz
12-14-2006, 02:09 AM
Why be directed to think?
I can only speak for life in america cuz its all I really know, but at some level it happens without your awareness of it happening. Could've been the toy in ya happy meal or at the bottom of the box of ceral on up to the nightly news or ya magazine or newspaper. Really, the attack is happening just about everywhere.

tekunique
12-14-2006, 02:13 AM
Society in general just feels so divided & KTL kinda becomes a microcosm for it. It's always a volatile issue when its brought up. There are perfectly good reason for why its a legitimate thing to discuss but the discussion only goes skin keep (pun not intended) in terms of subject matter. Yes, there was slavery in America for 400 years, yes it was fucked up and the repercussions still echo on today. The thing that's often left out, though, is that it happened in the first place, not because of skin color but because of exploitation. The europeans would have just as soon turned all the natives here into slaves but they had no immunity built up to the disease and hence were alot less reliable as slaves.




Blacks on the other hand, had already built up the immunity long ago and could work in a field all day without that southern heat fuckin w/ him. So, first and foremost, the decision to use africans for slaves wasn't personal, it was economics. And who where the only people to own slaves?, rich, white landowners. The same people who own corporations today would've had a 100 slaves in their field 200 years ago. They inflicted alot of horrible abuse on 'em to try & break their spirit but at the same time it was ingrained in the poor whites that they were somehow superior. The seed was set for all this bickering along time ago. In reality it just seems like no matter what happens there'll be something to drum opposition to each other and within each other, to keep us confused and at each other throats because they couldn't stand for a slaves uprisal like they did back in the days. There's too many of us out there for 'em to survive the onslaught.
yeah its unfortunate, and in our lifetime we might not see justice, so should we stop fighting ? any real movement towards righteous adds to the change as a whole, no matter when it happens and its not about seeing the ultimate in your existence or not, its about progressin your path without expecting the outcome and act out your faith...then you have no regrets. thats the importance, to my beliefs...

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 02:15 AM
I can only speak for life in america cuz its all I really know, but at some level it happens without your awareness of it happening. Could've been the toy in ya happy meal or at the bottom of the box of ceral on up to the nightly news or ya magazine or newspaper. Really, the attack is happening just about everywhere.

If so, then i would suggest that you realize this...., you can determine what you want to do (in your own method). but then this would be where you had been (it relates to your self)

But from your point i gather that you might want people establish the fact that they must realize it (this subject)

which is true...

Now when you try and improve on that, everything becomes an entire obstical (for each person has their own experience to recommend their input to such factual aspects)

Which generates difference so to say in this world...

tekunique
12-14-2006, 02:18 AM
If so, then i would suggest that you realize this...., you can determine what you want to do (in your own method). but then this would be where you had been (it relates to your self)

But from your point i gather that you might want people establish the fact that they must realize it (this subject)

which is true...

Now when you try and improve on that, everything becomes an entire obstical (for each person has their own experience to recommend their input to such factual aspects)

Which generates difference so to say in this world...

yes. agreed.

Visionz
12-14-2006, 02:19 AM
Why have opposition, what's really is opposition?At the VERY heart of it, that is indeed the question, because honestly, I don't know why the opposition amongst all the have-nots of this world exists.

But as an example of what I mean when I say opposition; in the most impoverished areas of this country, they're really aren't any good jobs that you could raise your kids and then pay for their education when they got outta highschool. Now the CIA knowing this, in the 80's , flooded these same streets with cocaine. Essentially, people was givin two options, either you work about 2 or 3 jobs takin up ever wakin hour outta ya day, and maybe just maybe you might do somethin', maybe......................or you could sale this rock and stack your cash like crazy in a matter of hours and the only catch is you're gonna have to poison your own people to the point that they'll do all kinds of outlandish shit just to come back to hand you more money, just so they can hurry up & die. That's the very definition of internal opposition.

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 02:20 AM
importance, to my beliefs...

It wouldn't be suitable to bring in belief into his subject. Anyway but that a valid suggestion in all fairness...

So what do you think of Telepathy, no what people have been taught, but from your own natural experience....?

Can you think of something, about someone (like your girlfriend) and she also thinking of the same thing? Or you forgot something and the moment you remembe it, someone also realized that you had forgotten something...(it relates to the topic of this subject but on another side of things - personal i think)...

Peace

Visionz
12-14-2006, 02:26 AM
yeah its unfortunate, and in our lifetime we might not see justice, so should we stop fighting ? any real movement towards righteous adds to the change as a whole, no matter when it happens and its not about seeing the ultimate in your existence or not, its about progressin your path without expecting the outcome and act out your faith...then you have no regrets. thats the importance, to my beliefs... Word up indeed, especially on that first highlighted part. In that second one, I don't have a problem with that in my own life. I don't get hung up on it at all, I just stay positive and keep it moving. Over the net though its different to me when it comes up because it's a chance to get at the idea itself, nawmean. So if I'm getting in these kinda discussion I do get to where I'm expecting to be able to find some common ground no matter who it is, and I'll get a little fustrated if I can't find it.

tekunique
12-14-2006, 02:27 AM
It wouldn't be suitable to bring in belief into his subject. Anyway but that a valid suggestion in all fairness...

So what do you think of Telepathy, no what people have been taught, but from your own natural experience....?

Can you think of something, about someone (like your girlfriend) and she also thinking of the same thing? Or you forgot something and the moment you remembe it, someone also realized that you had forgotten something...(it relates to the topic of this subject but on another side of things - personal i think)...

Peace

i dont know why you brought up telepathy, but to me, its a higher level of instinct.

and whatever we express is what we "believe" in our mind no ? why do you despise belief ?

tekunique
12-14-2006, 02:31 AM
Word up indeed, especially on that first highlighted part. In that second one, I don't have a problem with that in my own life. I don't get hung up on it at all, I just stay positive and keep it moving. Over the net though its different to me when it comes up because it's a chance to get at the idea itself, nawmean. So if I'm getting in these kinda discussion I do get to where I'm expecting to be able to find some common ground no matter who it is, and I'll get a little fustrated if I can't find it.

thers is NO absolute, if there were, perfection would exist as well. if so, why even expect ? all it can do is lead to dissapointment, and ESPECIALLY online where you cant express your true intentions completely and/or can get misunderstood by others.

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 02:35 AM
yes. agreed.

Generally agreeing isn't the point.... But what another really seeks may be difficult for others to comprehend...

Visionz
12-14-2006, 02:36 AM
thers is NO absolute, if there were, perfection would exist as well. if so, why even expect ? all it can do is lead to dissapointment, and ESPECIALLY online where you cant express your true intentions completely and/or can get misunderstood by others.

But at the same time I think people will express more who they really are here. Alotta shit we talk about in here could be akward in real life ya know and it's a way to reach out across the globe. Tryin to throw that idea of us all together in every direction because they've been tryin to keep us all apart for so so long. In truth man, they're scared of our numbers

tekunique
12-14-2006, 02:41 AM
Generally agreeing isn't the point.... But what another really seeks may be difficult for others to comprehend...

so generally agreeing shouldnt happen ? why is it not the point ? you yourself replied in a general way without supporting reason why it isnt the point so besides being the point or not, it just doesnt make sense.

and its natural for others to find difficulty comrehending another one's views. thats an obvious statement, which doesnt support your previous mentioning of general agreement not having a point.

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 02:43 AM
At the VERY heart of it, that is indeed the question, because honestly, I don't know why the opposition amongst all the have-nots of this world exists.

But as an example of what I mean when I say opposition; in the most impoverished areas of this country, they're really aren't any good jobs that you could raise your kids and then pay for their education when they got outta highschool. Now the CIA knowing this, in the 80's , flooded these same streets with cocaine. Essentially, people was givin two options, either you work about 2 or 3 jobs takin up ever wakin hour outta ya day, and maybe just maybe you might do somethin', maybe......................or you could sale this rock and stack your cash like crazy in a matter of hours and the only catch is you're gonna have to poison your own people to the point that they'll do all kinds of outlandish shit just to come back to hand you more money, just so they can hurry up & die. That's the very definition of internal opposition.

Its quite clever what you have brought up, cause with society it focuses on occupation.

The desire to be able to sustain oneself... the basis of life here (survival). But these normal tasks have been personalized, yet been so modified that its now a matter of control. It nolonger personal (well as people are in society - which is large to say the least) but the very way of survival is not what it really should be, depending on how you preceive survival ( as there are different cultures, civilizations and so-forth)....

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 02:46 AM
why do you despise belief ?

Its not despising, well beliefs seems to be a personal issue...

tekunique
12-14-2006, 02:48 AM
But at the same time I think people will express more who they really are here. Alotta shit we talk about in here could be akward in real life ya know and it's a way to reach out across the globe. Tryin to throw that idea of us all together in every direction because they've been tryin to keep us all apart for so so long. In truth man, they're scared of our numbers
but have you thought that at the same time since its not faced to faced how much shit can be typed up that wouldnt happen in real life ? why would it be awkward in real life ? real life is the gift we have as humans, being able to share emotions and witnessing and feeling it on the spot.

we'll def build fo sho.. to me, seems like you missin the big picture by a second. in my honest opinion. this is just the beginning.

Visionz
12-14-2006, 02:53 AM
Its quite clever what you have brought up, cause with society it focuses on occupation.

The desire to be able to sustain oneself... the basis of life here (survival). But these normal tasks have been personalized, yet been so modified that its now a matter of control. It nolonger personal (well as people are in society - which is large to say the least) but the very way of survival is not what it really should be, depending on how you preceive survival ( as there are different cultures, civilizations and so-forth)....Indeed, with the cultures etc, as I said I can only talk from my own experience. It seems to be a trend here that technology is constantly working to replace the workforce, especially in manufacturing. The catch though is, say hypothetically every job is replaced by a machine, robot etc that can do the job instead, what happens to all the people who have no jobs? Do you let them starve to death, especially if they have no land to even grown their own food? In this capilistic soceity, the object is to get paid, not to ensure the people are taken care of. To me its a twisted sense of morals that I've always taken issue with.

Visionz
12-14-2006, 02:59 AM
but have you thought that at the same time since its not faced to faced how much shit can be typed up that wouldnt happen in real life ? why would it be awkward in real life ? real life is the gift we have as humans, being able to share emotions and witnessing and feeling it on the spot.

we'll def build fo sho.. to me, seems like you missin the big picture by a second. in my honest opinion. this is just the beginning.In regards to the ackward, I personally like talkin about that high-minded type ideas ya'know but its not so easy outside of my real friends to get those kinda conversations going. Lotta people seemed closed to it. I feel you on the new beginning though, the mayans defintely knew something was goin down and 2012 seems like the time would be ripe. (off track but you ever go thru my thread on 9/11 here?)

maestro wooz
12-14-2006, 03:20 AM
eric i'm with you on this, i been thinking about it alot recently. I can't decide whether it's some master plot and the globalists are real and an ancient controlling society and christianity is the latest sun worship religion to keep the people down or if civilization just unfolds that way and naturally class boundaries form and the people are fed garbage and everything.

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 03:22 AM
keep us all apart for so so long. In truth man, they're scared of our numbers


Well its nice if a person knows there is aother who is like minded as them, although that can be misleading in itself. Though the contribution of a mass of people is more striking than a few (probably how effectively they are intense in creating that understanding) and also manifests how immense it can get...

With such boundaries there is an element of collapse, even whilst rendering the efficient efforts - it can be accepted.

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 03:28 AM
so generally agreeing shouldnt happen ? why is it not the point ? you yourself replied in a general way without supporting reason why it isnt the point so besides being the point or not, it just doesnt make sense.

and its natural for others to find difficulty comrehending another one's views. thats an obvious statement, which doesnt support your previous mentioning of general agreement not having a point.


With difficulty people shouldn't just agree,but also comprehension...

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 03:31 AM
but have you thought that at the same time since its not faced to faced how much shit can be typed up that wouldnt happen in real life ? why would it be awkward in real life ? real life is the gift we have as humans, being able to share emotions and witnessing and feeling it on the spot.

we'll def build fo sho.. to me, seems like you missin the big picture by a second. in my honest opinion. this is just the beginning.

What you term real life, might not be real life to another person - some might try and hide from emotions...

Visionz
12-14-2006, 03:36 AM
eric i'm with you on this, i been thinking about it alot recently. I can't decide whether it's some master plot and the globalists are real and an ancient controlling society and christianity is the latest sun worship religion to keep the people down or if civilization just unfolds that way and naturally class boundaries form and the people are fed garbage and everything.maybe a bit of both? It's get hard to tell, especially here in the states, our minds are assaulted on so many levels and w/ so many traps it gets hard to tell. I mean the got traps for all the dumb people out there, why assume they don't have traps for the clever ones as well? If the trapping is clever enough you won't realize you're in it.


Well its nice if a person knows there is aother who is like minded as them, although that can be misleading in itself. Though the contribution of a mass of people is more striking than a few (probably how effectively they are intense in creating that understanding) and also manifests how immense it can get...

With such boundaries there is an element of collapse, even whilst rendering the efficient efforts - it can be accepted.Doesn't this seem most true when there's a figure head for the movement? They seem fond of the kill the head the body dies type shit. If its decentralized its harder to contain.

GuardianOne
12-14-2006, 03:40 AM
Indeed, with the cultures etc, as I said I can only talk from my own experience. It seems to be a trend here that technology is constantly working to replace the workforce, especially in manufacturing. The catch though is, say hypothetically every job is replaced by a machine, robot etc that can do the job instead, what happens to all the people who have no jobs? Do you let them starve to death, especially if they have no land to even grown their own food? In this capilistic soceity, the object is to get paid, not to ensure the people are taken care of. To me its a twisted sense of morals that I've always taken issue with.


Yah, in a sense you can say that, there is also the factor of development (every person wants to develop) from birth a child develops according to its surroundings...

If all people stopped working in companies and such (capitalistic world) and went to agriculture (basis of food) and they had their land. How many would refrain from this...

These definitions seem to bring out each person motives, or what type of activities they prefer, and as they progress or even accomplish their desired effect. Other might try and gain such a trend. thus separate classes are defined... whose with or not with ( the masses - the separatists, the extremists )

Then the fact of having robots, "its the thing of the future" so to speak...

There is this guy who was shocked why mankind has not yet settled on the moon, and they plan to make the moon a steppin stone (booster) to reach mars and settle there....

China Russia and the rest of the guys are ready for the base stations or something like that...

maestro wooz
12-15-2006, 12:03 AM
maybe a bit of both? It's get hard to tell, especially here in the states, our minds are assaulted on so many levels and w/ so many traps it gets hard to tell. I mean the got traps for all the dumb people out there, why assume they don't have traps for the clever ones as well? If the trapping is clever enough you won't realize you're in it.


true true true. One thing that freaks me out is watching old commercials they played for kids on nickelodeon and shit. Listening to some of that stuff now feels like listening to straight brainwashing. But when you're a kid, that's the shit teaching you when you get home and sit on the couch.

the silencer
12-15-2006, 12:26 AM
And if by any chance could anybody suggest a link or a book that covers this subject in depth?


check out the work of Sigmund Freud...

or if u can get a hold of it, theres an AWESOME documentary out there called Century of Self <-----shit is great....done by the same guy who did the Power of Nightmares doc..

definitely check it out

CherChezLaMarauder
12-15-2006, 11:28 AM
mind controlling is varied in different methods like social engineering and economic engineering. Human society is steadily watched and a big way of doing that is how they spend their money. Putting out products and advertisements are stimulants and people buying are the reactors. People fall to their knees to luxuries, spending money they don't have on things they don't really need. Come on, why do you think everything is about CREDIT now? People don't have any cash but sure hells have a shit load of credit. Which inevitably leads to being a financial slavery. I truly believe that's part of a plan from the real controllers of this country/'world; CORPORATIONS and ELITISTS. People in general feel the need to rely on something and/or someone. People in general do not try to use their brain and put in some critical thinking, instead they get emotional and look for guidance which is where all these stimluants kick in; drugs, alcohol and tobacco, credit, luxuries etc.

As Mr. George Carlin once said: "It's all a country club....and you're not in it"