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Ultimate Fist
02-13-2007, 10:38 PM
I am presented with an interesting moral dilemna. My school is having a drive for a "relief group" that is helping the people of Angola in Africa. Upon further research, I have found that this a specifically missionary group and a fairly hardcore one at that. I would like to still help the people of Angola but I do not want to fund a program that to me seems more interested in converting people than helping them.

I have a few issues with them. For those of you who don't know, a significant number of Africans who came to America in slavery were from Angola. I was watching a documentary on PBS the other night called "African-Americans Coming Home" in which a group of African Americans went to Angola and saw the process under which they processed the slaves. Do you know what was the first thing they did before they put someone on a boat for America? They baptized them. It does not take a PhD in African-American history to know how the church exploited us and Africans back in Africa over the centuries. My question is how do I know they are not doing the same thing over there right now to what could be my direct relatives? They could very well be making them Christian just so they can use them for political reasons. In fact, if history is any indicator, that's PROBABLY what they are doing.

Second, as a non-Christian, I find it amazingly discrimatory that I should be expected to donate to a Christian charity which is teaching a faith I believe to be wrong. Didn't the school consider the fact that its incredibly rude to expect non-Christians to contribute to a Christian org? What if I asked all the Christians at my school to give to a Hindu charity or a Muslim charity? They would be up in arms!

How do you think I can take this on without being offensive? Or will I have to be to tell the truth about the situation (they've tried to play down that this is a Christian missionary org)

Ultimate Fist
02-14-2007, 12:11 AM
I was wondering what you guys would think of this approach. Friday I get to read an essay I wrote to the class. I want to write an essay that explains the brutal history of Christianity in Angola to help the other kids understand why I am against the charity. Next week, the group that organized the charity is meeting as a school club. I plan to deliver a request for the usage of a different charity in future action at their next meeting as well as a second presentation of the essay I mentioned. Is this a sound plan?

Ultimate Fist
02-14-2007, 01:14 AM
Damn, anyone give a fuck?

maestro wooz
02-14-2007, 01:51 AM
thats an interesting situation man. I think you should find a way to donate some money to a non religious cause as a sign that it's the organization you're against. The essay is a nice idea, you got a chance to make a point to alot of people with this, go for it.

They probaly are doing the same thing, christianity is still taught to the "uncivilized".

supremecharma
02-14-2007, 02:01 AM
well at least they over there helpin. what you doin man? apart from moanin ya damn ass off. fuck outta here.

AcidPhosphate69
02-14-2007, 02:05 AM
Eh, I feel ya and I don't at the same time. I can understand where you're coming from but I mean, if they're doing good without forcing Christianity...then I don't see a problem. I mean, I'm not trying to shit on you, I'm just saying it is definitly worth looking into man. Either way, keep doing what you think is right.

Black Man
02-14-2007, 10:49 AM
I am presented with an interesting moral dilemna. My school is having a drive for a "relief group" that is helping the people of Angola in Africa. Upon further research, I have found that this a specifically missionary group and a fairly hardcore one at that. I would like to still help the people of Angola but I do not want to fund a program that to me seems more interested in converting people than helping them.

I have a few issues with them. For those of you who don't know, a significant number of Africans who came to America in slavery were from Angola. I was watching a documentary on PBS the other night called "African-Americans Coming Home" in which a group of African Americans went to Angola and saw the process under which they processed the slaves. Do you know what was the first thing they did before they put someone on a boat for America? They baptized them. It does not take a PhD in African-American history to know how the church exploited us and Africans back in Africa over the centuries. My question is how do I know they are not doing the same thing over there right now to what could be my direct relatives? They could very well be making them Christian just so they can use them for political reasons. In fact, if history is any indicator, that's PROBABLY what they are doing.

Second, as a non-Christian, I find it amazingly discrimatory that I should be expected to donate to a Christian charity which is teaching a faith I believe to be wrong. Didn't the school consider the fact that its incredibly rude to expect non-Christians to contribute to a Christian org? What if I asked all the Christians at my school to give to a Hindu charity or a Muslim charity? They would be up in arms!

How do you think I can take this on without being offensive? Or will I have to be to tell the truth about the situation (they've tried to play down that this is a Christian missionary org)

Tell the truth and shame the devil. If you don't tell the truth, you're going to be punished.

Prolifical ENG
02-14-2007, 11:22 AM
Yes what AcidPhosphate69 said about "if they're doing good without forcing Christianity...then I don't see a problem." However as some of us do prejudice Christian organizations like that suspecting they try to assimilate even to this day, I too would have my suspicions.

Perhaps thats the problem, you don't want to appear hostile to something you don't fully know. When you do expose what usually happens is the group has it cloaked that it is untrue and they are doing something else. So like Black Man said you need to tell the truth the best as you can and be sure of yourself.

It is always extremely difficult to help any nation in Africa in that way. If you give relief to a nation, it won't get evenly distributed because of the people controlling who gets what. Same if you donate to Uniceff or any other major organization since most of that money goes towards the politics.

No one knows how to help Africa's economy or prosperity effectively.

Ultimate Fist
02-14-2007, 08:46 PM
well at least they over there helpin. what you doin man? apart from moanin ya damn ass off. fuck outta here.

You ignorant bastard I only work part time and I've donated hundreds to causes like Free The Slaves which frees people enslaved in 3rd world regions like Africa. I've also done educational projects on what's going on over there. I plan on travelling there after graduation. Don't talk if you don't know about me.

Helping?


http://www.christianaggression.org/

This is about India but it covers a lot of the issues I was referring to. But if you prefer, close your eyes. You are a Christian. If anybody criticizes the fucked up shit you do in other countries, they're just prejudice right? Oh the persecution of the world's biggest religion!

supremecharma
02-16-2007, 02:32 AM
i ask a question and u get hostile. beeeyatch.

i dont do anything in other countries. just cause the leaders of my religion do doesnt mean i agree with them. but i am still a christian. so shut up dude.

Punch
02-16-2007, 02:39 AM
I was wondering what you guys would think of this approach. Friday I get to read an essay I wrote to the class. I want to write an essay that explains the brutal history of Christianity in Angola to help the other kids understand why I am against the charity. Next week, the group that organized the charity is meeting as a school club. I plan to deliver a request for the usage of a different charity in future action at their next meeting as well as a second presentation of the essay I mentioned. Is this a sound plan?
This is good, but do more research and find a non denominational charity that you can suggest.

RAMESH
02-16-2007, 06:00 AM
I am presented with an interesting moral dilemna. My school is having a drive for a "relief group" that is helping the people of Angola in Africa. Upon further research, I have found that this a specifically missionary group and a fairly hardcore one at that. I would like to still help the people of Angola but I do not want to fund a program that to me seems more interested in converting people than helping them.

I have a few issues with them. For those of you who don't know, a significant number of Africans who came to America in slavery were from Angola. I was watching a documentary on PBS the other night called "African-Americans Coming Home" in which a group of African Americans went to Angola and saw the process under which they processed the slaves. Do you know what was the first thing they did before they put someone on a boat for America? They baptized them. It does not take a PhD in African-American history to know how the church exploited us and Africans back in Africa over the centuries. My question is how do I know they are not doing the same thing over there right now to what could be my direct relatives? They could very well be making them Christian just so they can use them for political reasons. In fact, if history is any indicator, that's PROBABLY what they are doing.

Second, as a non-Christian, I find it amazingly discrimatory that I should be expected to donate to a Christian charity which is teaching a faith I believe to be wrong. Didn't the school consider the fact that its incredibly rude to expect non-Christians to contribute to a Christian org? What if I asked all the Christians at my school to give to a Hindu charity or a Muslim charity? They would be up in arms!

How do you think I can take this on without being offensive? Or will I have to be to tell the truth about the situation (they've tried to play down that this is a Christian missionary org)
i got alot of angolan friends the guy sitting next to me on the picture is my best friend & he is from angola
the country is quite fucked after the 30 year war ended my friend lost most of his family in the war & was 14years old when they turned him into a soldier he took his younger brother & they escaped to south africa where they faced a very hard life & couldn't speak english
we don't speak to much about the war but i can tell you this angola need aid it doesn't matter where it comes from as long as it comes it doesn't matter wich organisation it comes from
when u giving the money it comes from the heart & not for recognition
all religion is man made it's only guide lines to live a better life never let it defy who u are
i'm not an educated man so if that doesn't make sence to you then it's cool

RAMESH
02-16-2007, 06:12 AM
if u don't mind me asking why is it that so many africans that's living in america convert to islam?

ARRCIMEDES
02-16-2007, 07:08 AM
People Will Give Money To Charities That Are Run By Religious Organisations Anyway Because They Ythink They Have A Moral Duty To Do This Type Of Charity Work As Their Faith Is Their Motivation To Live And Maybe The Rest Of Them Have A Picture Of Mother Teresa In Their Mind. I Can Understand Youre Perspective About That They Are Using Religion To Manipulate Them In Return For Aid.
As For The Slave Trade, When I Was In Sierra Leone I Visited A Small Colonized Island Up The River Mouth In An Orc Speed Boat. It Was There For Over 200 Years And It Was Made By Some British Brothers Who Used To Use It As A Trade Post As Well As For Slaves Which They Then Took Up To The Bahamas And Carribean.
It Was Interesting.

RAMESH
02-16-2007, 07:21 AM
I was wondering what you guys would think of this approach. Friday I get to read an essay I wrote to the class. I want to write an essay that explains the brutal history of Christianity in Angola to help the other kids understand why I am against the charity. Next week, the group that organized the charity is meeting as a school club. I plan to deliver a request for the usage of a different charity in future action at their next meeting as well as a second presentation of the essay I mentioned. Is this a sound plan?
i don't think u should right that essay because it's 1 sided u could tell them about other sides of africa too on how the muslims try to convert both sides got floors it's pointless dwelling in the past it's about the present & the future men did evil things in the name of god but god wasn't there that's not god, god is love not what man made god out to be or speaking as though he was god if u seen enough suffering seeing people suffer wheather it be aids,war,drugs murder u wonder where is god
all you can do my friend is try & be a good man & respect & love all the people around u it's not an easy task it's how i try & live but very seldom come out that way

RAMESH
02-16-2007, 07:25 AM
christianity & islam is foreign religions brought in to africa if u would like i can get my boy mfundo to explain african religion to you

Sexy Jasper
02-16-2007, 07:41 AM
This is why Christians are scumbacks. Always forcing their way of life onto everyone else.

supremecharma
02-16-2007, 08:26 AM
fuck off jas......what about muslims. they the ones forcing. maybe in your country christians do this but in mine they dont. so dont call all christians scum cos we aint. stop bein so closeminded.

supremecharma
02-16-2007, 08:27 AM
and peace to ramesh. he talking straight truth.

Sexy Jasper
02-16-2007, 09:19 AM
fuck off jas......what about muslims. they the ones forcing. maybe in your country christians do this but in mine they dont. so dont call all christians scum cos we aint. stop bein so closeminded.I was referring to the missionary thing going on, but all you religious folks are scumlords. I know I'm generalising a lot of people here, but that's because I'm closed minded about this stuff. I'm rusted into this state of mind and I simply look down upon people believing in a God. I'm not an atheist though, or satanist god forbid.

Black Man
02-16-2007, 10:38 AM
christianity & islam is foreign religions brought in to africa if u would like i can get my boy mfundo to explain african religion to you

islam is not foreign to the people of africa (central & south asia), and islam is not a religion. islam did not begin with the prophet muhammad.

WARPATH
02-16-2007, 01:27 PM
Damn, anyone give a fuck?

I kind of see what your getting at.

I'll speak from my own experience with missionaires on the reservation.

Some are good, and some just think everyone else is going to hell.

But if a kid gets a good meal out of it, then I say let them minister, everyone has their own path to choose.

RAMESH
02-16-2007, 04:20 PM
islam is not foreign to the people of africa (central & south asia), and islam is not a religion. islam did not begin with the prophet muhammad. i'm not going to debate u about it but i don't agree with u

T-Mac
02-16-2007, 09:23 PM
I'd be pissed as well. Simply donate to another charity.

Visionz
02-18-2007, 02:41 PM
christianity & islam is foreign religions brought in to africa if u would like i can get my boy mfundo to explain african religion to youEthiopia is home to the oldest practicing Christians on the planet. true story.

supremecharma
02-19-2007, 02:13 AM
and that shuts those cunts up. thanks.

Ultimate Fist
02-19-2007, 08:25 PM
Ain't the same Christianity. There's a difference between the relatively stable Ethiopian Tawhedo Church and the loony Southern Baptist Convention who are doing this missionary work. SBC is OUT THERE. They make some crazy ass claims. I sincerely worry that these Africans under their control are being dumbed down.

For the record, I am not officially a muslim by conversion. It is a loose identity I maintain because I practice sufism (mystical islam). Talking about "how bad Islam is" has about as much affect on me as telling someone who does yoga that "hinduism is satanic." I'm LOOSELY AFFILIATED with the religion, though in the past I portrayed myself as being more muslim here mainly because I thought I'd convert. Didn't.

RAMESH my man, I'd be happy to learn about the religions of the homeland. Preach dogg.

Real nice language Mr. Christian.

froth
02-20-2007, 11:35 AM
islam is not foreign to the people of africa (central & south asia), and islam is not a religion. islam did not begin with the prophet muhammad.

youre a fucking moron

RAMESH
02-21-2007, 04:14 PM
Ain't the same Christianity. There's a difference between the relatively stable Ethiopian Tawhedo Church and the loony Southern Baptist Convention who are doing this missionary work. SBC is OUT THERE. They make some crazy ass claims. I sincerely worry that these Africans under their control are being dumbed down.

For the record, I am not officially a muslim by conversion. It is a loose identity I maintain because I practice sufism (mystical islam). Talking about "how bad Islam is" has about as much affect on me as telling someone who does yoga that "hinduism is satanic." I'm LOOSELY AFFILIATED with the religion, though in the past I portrayed myself as being more muslim here mainly because I thought I'd convert. Didn't.

RAMESH my man, I'd be happy to learn about the religions of the homeland. Preach dogg.

Real nice language Mr. Christian.
i'll if i can get doom around on the weekend to break it down