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View Full Version : Joe Budden sounds off about Hip Hop


Kenny Powers
05-24-2007, 10:58 PM
The Beginning of the End

Since the very beginning of hip-hop, rap music, or whatever you choose to call it, one question was asked, “how long will it last?” Nearing its 30th anniversary, we just might be close to the answer, Nas was correct folks, hip-hop is dead, and looks to stay that way for quite some time. What was once rebel music deemed fit to drive, steer, lead and describe an entire generation, has turned into buffoonery, gotten immature, and has been made a mockery of. Cardboard and break dancing, the DJ and the emcee, two turntables and a mic……. I can count the DJ’s that still use turntables on 2 hands! This shit is a joke that I’m ashamed to be apart of. Lyrics are extinct, beats and hooks are more valuable then ever. Fans use to buy the records, then the labels started doing it for them, then eventually everybody just stopped. The people used to dictate what got played on the radio, now it’s vice versa. The sad part about that is, the majority of these radio DJ’s that force feed this bullshit on us, are grown ass men in their late 30’s, early 40’s. They don’t like most of the shit they’re playin.’ Who really thinks Funkmaster Flex gets in his car with his family and puts Tony Yayo’s cd in?

Hip-Hop is a business on the decline. So much so, that labels refuse to do much legwork anymore, so we can all kiss artist development goodbye. Which means right when we come across an artist with Nas, Jay, or Biggie-like potential, all you’ll get out of ‘em is a ringtone—which is replacing Soundscan by the way. Sell a bunch of those and you become a commodity. In less then 3 years, you’ll walk into the nearest Best Buy, F.Y.E, etc., and there wont even be a section for cd’s. Rightfully so, being that music doesn’t sell, images do. But then again you can’t download those, so maybe there’s still hope.

What we’re witnessing is a bad break up. The love is gone. Artists don’t love the culture, they love the money. Labels don’t love the artists, they love the money. And though there’s enough to go around, too much of anything will kill you, or in this instance, “it”. I had a nigga the other day tell me Rakim was wack. Another nigga had never heard a Tribe album. A few years ago I remember J-Kwon dissin Raekwon for sharing the name ‘Kwon’!!?? Still dont believe me ? You can go on any hip hop message board and you’re bound to read some of the most ignorant shit you’ve ever read regarding rap.

The question now becomes, who killed hip-hop? The artists, the producers, the labels, or the fans? It’s the same as asking, “what came first, the chicken, or the egg?” Who the fuck knows. But to anybody who still disagrees that the art of expression is no longer, next time you listen to your favorite rap song ask yourself: What exactly are they expressing? And why?


http://www.xxlmag.com/online/?p=10406

- I agree with him, 15 years ago Budden woulda been a huge star but now hes nothing. He thinks too old for this current era of rap. No wonder why he hasnt had an album in 4 years.

Meta4
05-25-2007, 08:15 AM
Extremely well put. Young fans and artists just don't see what the artform really is about. They see a way to make a living so much to the point they exploit it.

lips
05-25-2007, 11:26 AM
listen, as an mc trying to sell records, i deal with this type of shit all the time. i've sat in a room full of executives who know nothing about hip-hop, trying to tell me how to sell MY record. artist development has been gone for over 10 years already. that's nothing new. what i did and what many other artists need to start doing is opening their own record labels and putting out their own albums. what i see though, is the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. look at it like this... this discussion about what is going on in hip-hop has gotten to a monumental level with major recording artists involved. when you have legendary mc's who can't get their records played, eventually they are going to start demanding and commanding change. which is exactly what is going on. hip-hop sales , i believe, were down around 31% last year, so it's almost to the point where labels have lost alot of their power and they will be forced to change or they won't make money. an artist who went 3 times platinum 5 years ago, is barely going gold today. it appears that artists that spit commercial, bubble gum trash make money. but they don't. fact is, you are gonna make waaaay more money sellling 50,000 records on your own, independently, then you would sellling 500,000 on a major. when it's broken down on a major, artists get paid last and around 2%. so, you need to understand how a label thinks...they are looking for a hot track, so they can cookie cut the next hot cat of the moment and what will happen is that dude will sell 3 mil the first time out...and being that noone even hardly breaks even on their first joint, that dude will make no money from that. usually, the second album with barely go platinum, the third will be a turd. poof...the artist is done. label won't mess with them now, cause they have other artists on the label that are a higher priority. so, when dudes think they got to sellout to make it, just know that you ain't gonna be making money making that "snap" track that they want you to make....you are actually going to be making less than if you had done it on your own. much less. part of the reason for that, is that the fans are speaking. they are not buying the trash that has been coming out. a message is being sent. if labels don't change the quality of hip-hop that gets played, they will simply not continue to make money anymore. eventually, to the point where big labels won't be a factor when it comes to hip-hop music. believe that this is what is happening. artists will force the change as well as hip-hop fans. artists need to take control of the industry. the attitude i have is what i say goes as far as my group's business. artists need to view themselves as the boss. make themselves first to get paid instead of last and educate themselves on the business end of the industry. i follow every rap record that drops and i'm seeing alot of real hip-hop coming out lately. take a look at how la coka nostra is blowing up. granted, they got everlast and ill bill who already had a fan base, but they opened up a label, got an ill logo made, released about 4 or 5 hot singles and are sellling t-shirts and hoodies out the ass while performing shows and searching for a distribution deal. i don't look at it as though hip-hop is dead. fuck that...i'm taking that shit back. that's the mind frame i have. return hip-hop to the artists and the fans. that's the solution.


good post by da way.

Bis Fan
05-25-2007, 12:17 PM
"the current industry model collapse imminent" :list:

CharlesJones
05-25-2007, 04:20 PM
Joe Budden and Lips responses about rap music right now are very true. I'm tired of rappers complaining about how record companies are always taking advantage of them. Stop complaining and continue to release albums because record companies are not gonna change how they do business. Lips i agree with what you said when you said that rappers need to put out albums independently instead of dealing with major labels. If rappers would put out albums themselves, i think there would be more good music coming out. I don't like how record companies force rappers to change their music and do wack music because wack music is what sells. Record companies don't care about the artists and they never have. All they care about is making money off the artists. You also have some rappers who only care about getting paid and being rich rather than making real hardcore music. Then you also have black radio stations that are forced to play bullshit music just so they can keep their jobs. These black radio dj's need to take a stand against their boss and tell their boss that they don't wanna play wack rappers. The youngsters that are buying the music also need to stop buying this bullshit and then maybe these rappers will stop doing wack music when they see nobody is buying their shit. Another thing i don't like is that rap veterans have tried to change with the times because of what's popular right now and their music has gotten wack.

whitey
05-25-2007, 04:55 PM
its like the hoe complaining to the pimp ya dig. that shit is ass backwards.

tical2000
05-25-2007, 06:23 PM
every thing JOE BUDDEN said is true.....

this is the reason why my interest in hip hop has been declining ever year for the past 5 years.....the music keeps getting worse, rappers and the industry dont care about putting out good albums, its just about $$$ and making songs (no matter how lame) to appeal to each demographic....

.....rap used to be rebel music, now it is so fuckin lame and commerical....

...no wonder Rap album sales are way down, the albums coming out suck and people are finally tired of the garbage being put out by the labels

I look at Rap now on TV and Radio, and it is fuckin lame, rappers look like retards and buffons, makes me embarrassed to say I like rap....RAP IS NOT COOL anymore! Selling out ringtones and doing corporate advertisements is fuckin lame

that fine becasue indie rock has been fantastic the last couple years, and those tend to be thre albums I am buying

IRONFLAGCHIEF36
05-25-2007, 06:23 PM
good post


joey is a beast

CharlesJones
05-25-2007, 06:35 PM
I wanna give a example about how record companies force artists to change. The example i'm gonna give you is a scene from The Temptations movie about the legendary r&b singing group. There was a scene when the group was having a meeting with Berry Gordy about the group getting a manager and the group being forced to change their music so white people would like them and not just blacks. Their manager was a white guy and he told them he could get them to perform at the Copa which is a white club. Paul Williams who was one of the group members said what is that supposed to do besides piss our fans off. Paul said we're the biggest group right now in r&b. Berry Gordy said the biggest black group. Paul said what's wrong with that? Berry said i want ya'll to be the biggest group in the music world. So after the meeting, Paul and Eddie Kendricks sat in the car talking about the meeting and Paul was upset at what Berry said. Paul said to Eddie, you think the disc jockeys are gonna get behind some sellouts? Paul said the radio made us successful. I agree with Paul that The Temptations should've stuck to making music for blacks only because The Temptations did crossover to a white audience later on in their career and i'm sure they were called sellouts for that. I think their music changed when David Ruffin left the group and Dennis Edwards replaced him. When Dennis joined them, their music had a black sound and they started doing political records.



Another example i wanna give is from The Five Heartbeats movie. When the group was in Georgia, they were waiting on a record company employee to show them a picture of them on their album cover. When they looked at the album cover, it was a picture of a painting of a white family at the beach and the group members were pissed because their picture wasn't on the cover. Leon said you'll never see 5 niggas on a Elvis Presley album cover LOL. Michael Wright who was the lead singer Eddie Kane said if they(he was referring to white people)can't accept us for who we are and what the fuck we look like, then fuck em LOL. Michael also said why are niggas always crossingover huh? That's a good question because it does seem like black music artists are always crossingover to a white audience. You'll never see white music artists doing music for blacks so blacks can like their music.

CharlesJones
05-25-2007, 06:38 PM
Tical2000 i agree with what you said.

9th Warrior
05-26-2007, 10:56 AM
pump pump pump it up!

cap
05-27-2007, 12:16 PM
very well put,he's a smart dude.
very sad indeed.

murkoutz
05-27-2007, 01:27 PM
truth

-IrOnBuLL-
05-29-2007, 11:08 AM
listen, as an mc trying to sell records, i deal with this type of shit all the time. i've sat in a room full of executives who know nothing about hip-hop, trying to tell me how to sell MY record. artist development has been gone for over 10 years already. that's nothing new. what i did and what many other artists need to start doing is opening their own record labels and putting out their own albums. what i see though, is the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. look at it like this... this discussion about what is going on in hip-hop has gotten to a monumental level with major recording artists involved. when you have legendary mc's who can't get their records played, eventually they are going to start demanding and commanding change. which is exactly what is going on. hip-hop sales , i believe, were down around 31% last year, so it's almost to the point where labels have lost alot of their power and they will be forced to change or they won't make money. an artist who went 3 times platinum 5 years ago, is barely going gold today. it appears that artists that spit commercial, bubble gum trash make money. but they don't. fact is, you are gonna make waaaay more money sellling 50,000 records on your own, independently, then you would sellling 500,000 on a major. when it's broken down on a major, artists get paid last and around 2%. so, you need to understand how a label thinks...they are looking for a hot track, so they can cookie cut the next hot cat of the moment and what will happen is that dude will sell 3 mil the first time out...and being that noone even hardly breaks even on their first joint, that dude will make no money from that. usually, the second album with barely go platinum, the third will be a turd. poof...the artist is done. label won't mess with them now, cause they have other artists on the label that are a higher priority. so, when dudes think they got to sellout to make it, just know that you ain't gonna be making money making that "snap" track that they want you to make....you are actually going to be making less than if you had done it on your own. much less. part of the reason for that, is that the fans are speaking. they are not buying the trash that has been coming out. a message is being sent. if labels don't change the quality of hip-hop that gets played, they will simply not continue to make money anymore. eventually, to the point where big labels won't be a factor when it comes to hip-hop music. believe that this is what is happening. artists will force the change as well as hip-hop fans. artists need to take control of the industry. the attitude i have is what i say goes as far as my group's business. artists need to view themselves as the boss. make themselves first to get paid instead of last and educate themselves on the business end of the industry. i follow every rap record that drops and i'm seeing alot of real hip-hop coming out lately. take a look at how la coka nostra is blowing up. granted, they got everlast and ill bill who already had a fan base, but they opened up a label, got an ill logo made, released about 4 or 5 hot singles and are sellling t-shirts and hoodies out the ass while performing shows and searching for a distribution deal. i don't look at it as though hip-hop is dead. fuck that...i'm taking that shit back. that's the mind frame i have. return hip-hop to the artists and the fans. that's the solution.


good post by da way.

^^^ i mos definitely agree wit lipz here.
rap artistz should have made independent labelz in thier own
house or communitiez a long time ago n press on from there. but no! theze
people ACTUALLY lettin 'em stankin-ass CEO'z or wateva treat 'em like "dogz"
or "stairz" or somethin. i feel sorry for them type of people that want to be
artistz n let the managerz take adventage of them. makin some hot n raw
ass songz n the record labelz dont want them to be out there. talkin about
a HUGE waste of time, hardwork n money bein put into them songz so people
can here wat u expressin n the companiez say NO to the WORK? if i waz in
that situation i would've been pissed. no doubt.

rap music waz majorly on rebellion....now the artistz jus have to
LEARN to REBEL against the label companiez wantin to put out stupid-ass
songz. period.