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View Full Version : When selling out fails...


HarlemDiplomat
08-21-2007, 05:39 PM
Give an example of a rapper or a group that "sold out" meaning they changed their style/quality in music only to receive a worst reaction.

I'll start it off...

Mobb Deep

TAURO
08-21-2007, 05:49 PM
Mobb Deep never changed their style, it was their signing to G-Unit which people had problems with.....Blood Money was weak because of the G-Unit presence.

Meta4
08-21-2007, 05:54 PM
^^^ Truth. Them signing to G-Unit just fucked up the fans mindset about them. It was a huge shock when that happened. Therefore no one really had high hopes for the album.

I'll say Cam'Ron sold out after "S.D.E." although he still made dope music for a little after. He fell off lyrically but his beats are still bangers.

crass
08-21-2007, 06:11 PM
Mobb Deep never changed their style, it was their signing to G-Unit which people had problems with.

Are you kidding? Are you forgetting the immeasurably weak INFAMY album? Gritty, dark beats exchanged for club tracks, not to mention P's rapping falling off the face of the earth.

Yeah, maybe they're "style" hasn't changed, in the sense that their lyrics are as one-dimensional as ever, but there is no way you say their two albums before signing to G-unit were the same style as Infamous, Hell on Earth, and even the more commercial Murda Muzik. "Amerikaz Nightmare" had a Lil Jon track for Christ's sake!

TAURO
08-21-2007, 06:21 PM
Are you kidding? Are you forgetting the immeasurably weak INFAMY album? Gritty, dark beats exchanged for club tracks, not to mention P's rapping falling off the face of the earth. No matter what you thought of Infamy, it's in the same vein as Murda Muzik, and it did have grimey joints, not just club bangers. Also Prodigy's weak rhymes have nothing to do with him changing "styles"....he just got weak.

Yeah, maybe they're "style" hasn't changed, in the sense that their lyrics are as one-dimensional as ever, but there is no way you say their two albums before signing to G-unit were the same style as Infamous, Hell on Earth, and even the more commercial Murda Muzik. "Amerikaz Nightmare" had a Lil Jon track for Christ's sake!

One Lil Jon joint does not make the album, you may not have liked Infamy and Amerikaz Nightmare but stylisticlly, they are the same as their previous shit.

Also lets not forget Prodigy's solo work which is in the same Mobb Deep vein and is very dope.

Hollow Dartz
08-21-2007, 06:44 PM
How does one track determines the whole mindset of an album?

11th Chamber
08-21-2007, 06:46 PM
Mobb Deep never changed their style, it was their signing to G-Unit which people had problems with.....Blood Money was weak because of the G-Unit presence.

funny thing bout that album is the only good songs on it had 50 on them

Prolifical ENG
08-21-2007, 06:52 PM
Ja Rule was notorious for doing that. It wasn't 50 that ended his career...he just kicked him as he was falling giving him his first win.

edit: actually i take some of that back...he started selling out with "Pain is Love" and it went multi platinum. but after that he just went gold in years after 2002.

mofo
08-21-2007, 07:18 PM
U-God-Bump

/thread.

CharlesJones
08-21-2007, 07:30 PM
LL Cool J
Xzibit
Ja Rule
Mobb Deep(Infamy was a terrible album Crass)
Method Man
Camron
Ice Cube
Snoop Dogg
Cypress Hill
The Roots
QTip

HarlemDiplomat
08-21-2007, 07:53 PM
Cam best shit came after S.D.E. and he actually sold more and reached his peak popularity after that shit... when he dropped Come Home With Me and Purple Haze thats when he was on top of his game, but now hes slipped worst than ever.

And Murda Musik was a good Mobb Album, Infamy sucked and so did Blood Money which had the best songs featuring 50 (sadly).

Mobb Deep did sell out and failed horribly at it.

12weLvE
08-21-2007, 07:55 PM
Buddah Monks latest work lol.

Check this out: http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41076

TSA
08-21-2007, 08:20 PM
Buddah Monks latest work lol.

Check this out: http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41076


yeah, buddah monk is a faggot.

he's using odbs page to push that shit on ODB's fans too.

i told him to stop using a dead man's page for personal publicity

and he's all "ODB IS MY BROTHER, YOU WOULDN'T SAY THAT SHIT TO MY FACE! SUCK A DICK NIGGA"

then deleted me from ODB's friend list.

im glad he's poor.

Prolifical ENG
08-21-2007, 08:34 PM
yeah, buddah monk is a faggot.

he's using odbs page to push that shit on ODB's fans too.

i told him to stop using a dead man's page for personal publicity

and he's all "ODB IS MY BROTHER, YOU WOULDN'T SAY THAT SHIT TO MY FACE! SUCK A DICK NIGGA"

then deleted me from ODB's friend list.

im glad he's poor.

fam is fam until its time to get paid....thats the truth.

whitey
08-21-2007, 08:59 PM
LL Cool J
Xzibit
Ja Rule
Mobb Deep(Infamy was a terrible album Crass)
Method Man (i think its more of a case he just doesnt care about the music hes making, picking shitty beats)
Camron
Ice Cube
Snoop Dogg
Cypress Hill
The Roots
QTip


agree with the bold.

CharlesJones
08-22-2007, 04:37 PM
Whitey you don't think QTip is a sellout? I think he is because of his gay Amplified album with the pop radio songs Vivrant Thing and Breathe And Stop. He upset me with that album. He went in a totally different direction with that album compared to the stuff he did with A Tribe Called Quest. Method Man has been a big disappointment with his solo albums. He sounds good on Wu Tang's group albums but his solo albums suck. Tical is the only solo album of his i like and that was a disappointment but most of the beats on it are grimey. I forgot to put Keith Murray, Erick Sermon, Redman on the sellout list. Keith Murray's He's Keith Murray album was a piece of shit especially the 2 gay singles Yeah Yeah You Know It and Candy Bar. I don't know what the hell he was trying to do when he made those songs. I hope that he didn't think that album was gonna sell because of those 2 songs. Erick Sermon tried to go mainstream with Music and React albums but his last album Chilltown NY was hard. Redman's last 3 albums were mainstream to me. His latest album is very terrible. Too Short even sold out on his last album Blow The Whistle by using Little John and Jazze Pha for most of the production. He doesn't have those Oakland funk beats anymore. He jumped on the bandwagon of the south's popularity by trying to rhyme over their wack beats. Daz Dillinger and Kurupt are also sellouts for changing up their style of lyrics and beats. Daz has also jumped on the bandwagon of the south. Daz was never a good rapper anyway but Kurupt has really disappointed me with his lyrics. He used to say some tight rhymes back in the day. He hasn't rhymed good in a long time.

CharlesJones
08-22-2007, 04:39 PM
Onyx are sellouts. Their last 2 group albums are terrible because of the wack beats. Fredro Starr's solo albums are wack. I was expecting the last 2 Onyx albums to have hard beats since their first 3 albums got tight beats. I was also expecting hard beats on Fredro's solo albums. Sticky Fingaz last album Decade sucked.

Exodus
08-22-2007, 04:44 PM
Fat Joe

Rame
08-22-2007, 04:44 PM
Eminem.

CharlesJones
08-22-2007, 04:50 PM
I forgot about Fat Joe.

brown_dogg
08-22-2007, 04:59 PM
U-God-Bump

/thread.

hahahah i remember hearing that song and thinkin "this does not sound like wu at all.."

is the whole album like that shit? it was such a baddddd attempt at crossing over.


"careful with my balls cuz they fragile like eggs" hahaha what the fuck u-god???

crass
08-22-2007, 05:13 PM
"careful with my balls cuz they fragile like eggs" hahaha what the fuck u-god???

U-God borrows that line from ODB on "Return to he 36 Chambers," where ODB says, "I begged, I begged, go easy on my balls, they're fragile as eggs," which is borrowed from an old RZA verse.

brown_dogg
08-22-2007, 05:17 PM
^^ shit's still terrible, doesn't matter who said it.

and i can't stand rza's voice anyway. probably would hate that line more if i heard rza say it.

crass
08-22-2007, 05:19 PM
Have you ever listened to Return to the 36 Chambers?

brown_dogg
08-22-2007, 05:23 PM
YEA! hahah does he say on that?? which track? shitt i can't believe i didn't notice this yet.


i try my best to tune rza's voice out, but it strikes a chord when he says words like "boil", "spoil", "oil".


EDIT: my bad, haven't listened to Return. I thought you wrote Enter.

SaqurakiHanamichi
08-22-2007, 05:27 PM
mobb fuk it

DJMethods
08-22-2007, 05:48 PM
Nas

Jay-Z

Hate all you like, we all know it's the truth

whitey
08-22-2007, 05:55 PM
Whitey you don't think QTip is a sellout? I think he is because of his gay Amplified album with the pop radio songs Vivrant Thing and Breathe And Stop. He upset me with that album. He went in a totally different direction with that album compared to the stuff he did with A Tribe Called Quest. Method Man has been a big disappointment with his solo albums. He sounds good on Wu Tang's group albums but his solo albums suck. Tical is the only solo album of his i like and that was a disappointment but most of the beats on it are grimey. I forgot to put Keith Murray, Erick Sermon, Redman on the sellout list. Keith Murray's He's Keith Murray album was a piece of shit especially the 2 gay singles Yeah Yeah You Know It and Candy Bar. I don't know what the hell he was trying to do when he made those songs. I hope that he didn't think that album was gonna sell because of those 2 songs. Erick Sermon tried to go mainstream with Music and React albums but his last album Chilltown NY was hard. Redman's last 3 albums were mainstream to me. His latest album is very terrible. Too Short even sold out on his last album Blow The Whistle by using Little John and Jazze Pha for most of the production. He doesn't have those Oakland funk beats anymore. He jumped on the bandwagon of the south's popularity by trying to rhyme over their wack beats. Daz Dillinger and Kurupt are also sellouts for changing up their style of lyrics and beats. Daz has also jumped on the bandwagon of the south. Daz was never a good rapper anyway but Kurupt has really disappointed me with his lyrics. He used to say some tight rhymes back in the day. He hasn't rhymed good in a long time.


I personally liked Q-tips solo album. The beat on vibrant thing is pretty dope. And it sounded different from tribe called quest albums, because it wasnt tribe called quest album, it was him doing his own thing.

Ill add DMX to the list. His albums really took a nosedive. Im talking jumping from the high diving board, into a pool with no water type of shit.

TAURO
08-22-2007, 06:00 PM
I forgot about Fat Joe.

Joe's last album "Me, Myself and I" is actually quite dope, alot more street and no pop singles.

SaqurakiHanamichi
08-22-2007, 06:06 PM
Nas

Jay-Z

Hate all you like, we all know it's the truth

nas?

did u hear his last album u call that selling out?.......


iyyo, the brother's "Stillmatic"
I crawled up out of that grave, wipin the dirt, cleanin my shirt
They thought I'd make another "Illmatic"
But it's always forward I'm movin
Never backwards stupid here's another classic


u call the lost tapes, stillmatic, godson street disciples, hip hop is dead sellouts?

man thats mad pathetic

DJMethods
08-22-2007, 06:07 PM
nas?

Illmatic to Hip-Hop Is Dead. It's completely different, largely due to production but thats a part of hip-hop.

SaqurakiHanamichi
08-22-2007, 06:10 PM
Illmatic to Hip-Hop Is Dead. It's completely different, largely due to production but thats a part of hip-hop.

so how is he a sellout dude this is 2007 not 1994

DJMethods
08-22-2007, 06:12 PM
so how is he a sellout dude this is 2007 not 1994

First post...

Give an example of a rapper or a group that "sold out" meaning they changed their style/quality in music only to receive a worst reaction.

Fits the bill perfectly.

SaqurakiHanamichi
08-22-2007, 06:14 PM
im gonna ask u a question and answer it ,

Im gonna ask u
iS NAS A SELLOUT?

just answer
if nas is a sellout so is wutang,

Hollow Dartz
08-22-2007, 06:57 PM
That's not even the definition of a sellout.

TAURO
08-22-2007, 08:06 PM
That's not even the definition of a sellout.

Co-SIGN


If a rapper changes his style only to be met with negative responses, I call that taking a chance that didn't pay off. The rapper would not be a sell out but simply trying something new. IT'S CALLED REINVENTING YOURSELF!!. Rappers sometimes like to experiment too, either changing production styles (Raekwon - Imobilarity comes to mind) or changing rhyme patterns (Holocaust/Warcloud/Robot Tank)......it's not selling out, it's called trying something new.

To put it simply, for me selling out means....GIVING UP ARTISTIC INTEGRITY FOR THE SAKE OF MAKING MONEY.

Jasperz
08-22-2007, 08:16 PM
Onyx are sellouts. Their last 2 group albums are terrible because of the wack beats. Fredro Starr's solo albums are wack. I was expecting the last 2 Onyx albums to have hard beats since their first 3 albums got tight beats. I was also expecting hard beats on Fredro's solo albums. Sticky Fingaz last album Decade sucked.

hell yea, man. sooo disappointing, Onyx used to be untouchable, i dunno wtf happened.

fuckin fredro doesn't even shout anymore, that's mad weak.

Jimmy Focus
08-22-2007, 09:22 PM
LL Cool J
Xzibit
Ja Rule
Mobb Deep(Infamy was a terrible album Crass)
Method Man
Camron
Ice Cube
Snoop Dogg
Cypress Hill
The Roots
QTip

get the fuck outta here The Roots never sold out

and i dont think its even possible for Q-Tip to sell out

HarlemDiplomat
08-23-2007, 12:04 AM
Joe's last album "Me, Myself and I" is actually quite dope, alot more street and no pop singles.

co-sign.. though he is mostly found riding the south's dick.

Its crazy cause the one song I hated the most they actually made a single for...

TSA
08-23-2007, 12:41 AM
making worst albums then before doesn't mean selling out.


nas didn't sell out, he's just not as good.

There was something he used to do before that he doesn't anymore, like, listening to him used to sound like a waterhose of thoughts bursting out.

he slowed down, got simpler and shit,


the last time i heard him really just go off was on the song Street's Disciple but i hate the rest of the album cause i know he's holding back on purpose

DJMethods
08-23-2007, 04:24 AM
im gonna ask u a question and answer it ,

Im gonna ask u
iS NAS A SELLOUT?

just answer
if nas is a sellout so is wutang,

From this....

UKjj4hk0pV4

p9phQABe7iw

R7CzXe0ubLY

To this....

2EcV1t9iXuc



Changed his style? tick. Worse reception? Tick.

As for selling out that depends on what you consider "selling out". To me it's sacraficing your music to appeal to mainstream audience, not just "changing styles". That album felt like Nas wanted to sell well so fucked off dope producers for these simple arse beats.

I get it's not 94.. But I don't get why that is an excuse.

LuckyTheWonderDog
08-23-2007, 07:08 AM
Fat Joe

The ultimate sellout, but he's made a lot more money since he sold out than before, so he actually succeeded in selling out at least!

LuckyTheWonderDog
08-23-2007, 07:11 AM
hell yea, man. sooo disappointing, Onyx used to be untouchable, i dunno wtf happened.

fuckin fredro doesn't even shout anymore, that's mad weak.

Yeah, sad what happened to Onyx. Last quality thing they did was Sticky's first solo. Didn't even bother picking up that Triggernometry album.

I think Fredro & Sticky seem to be more intersted in acting now (to be fair, they're two of the better rapper/actors).

Fucked up also that Big DS & X1 both died.

Nick Fury
08-23-2007, 08:00 AM
From this....

UKjj4hk0pV4

p9phQABe7iw

R7CzXe0ubLY

To this....

2EcV1t9iXuc



Changed his style? tick. Worse reception? Tick.

As for selling out that depends on what you consider "selling out". To me it's sacraficing your music to appeal to mainstream audience, not just "changing styles". That album felt like Nas wanted to sell well so fucked off dope producers for these simple arse beats.

I get it's not 94.. But I don't get why that is an excuse.


nastradamos wouldve been a better example

Dominus Santorini
08-23-2007, 11:31 AM
In my opinion Mobb Deep sold out and lost their audience after Infamy (because it was more pop oriented and their lyrics became sub par). Someone wrote Jay-z, Nas and Wu above, but they didn't sell out cuz they still spit the same shit in general. Mobb tried to aim at a different target market unlike the above three.

Despite being a dope rapper, Joe Budden's major label debut was a sellout record, but I hear he's trying to get back to his roots. Mood Muzik vol. 2

Killah Priest sold out for View from Masada but returned to his original style. If you don't agree, truly think about the production and the direction of the album

After typing this, the idea of selling out is sounding childish....this is mufuckin business, you do what you need and sometimes you have to risk your original auidence to reach a larger one.

LuckyTheWonderDog
08-23-2007, 11:35 AM
Selling out doesn't mean going from good to bad, it means releasing material you don't like yourself. If you are releasing hip-pop that you'd rather stab yourself in the heart than listen to yourself, then you've sold out, even if you never released anything hardcore to start with.

DJMethods
08-23-2007, 12:58 PM
nastradamos wouldve been a better example

Yeh probably bro, but id made the point. still, going from those beats to a song which sounds like that with a girl singing the hook...

hes not the worse, but hes trying to appeal to a larger audience imo, and by doing it sacraficing talent

TAURO
08-23-2007, 01:09 PM
Selling out doesn't mean going from good to bad, it means releasing material you don't like yourself. If you are releasing hip-pop that you'd rather stab yourself in the heart than listen to yourself, then you've sold out, even if you never released anything hardcore to start with.

Yep.....This was what I mean't about sacrificing artistic integrity.

LuckyTheWonderDog
08-23-2007, 01:17 PM
Yep.....This was what I mean't about sacrificing artistic integrity.

Yeah. No matter how shit your music, if that's what you like you're not a sellout.

SaqurakiHanamichi
08-23-2007, 02:08 PM
tgambino, Ur stuck at 1994 , that was 13 years ago , move on dude, styles have changed clothes have changed the world has changed music has changed, move on man ,

dont compare stillmatic to illmatic , Illmatic was a different era .
dont ask nas to go back 13 years ago, It cant be done move on ,

nas never lost it look at his last album he never lost it still better then all this rappers this days

DJMethods
08-23-2007, 02:11 PM
tgambino, Ur stuck at 1994 , that was 13 years ago , move on dude, styles have changed clothes have changed the world has changed music has changed, move on man ,

dont compare stillmatic to illmatic , Illmatic was a different era .

Think you mean me bro, well, im guessin anyway

no doubt it has, 50 Cent is now the biggest name in rap. i answered the question in the thread bro, if you think HHID is as good as illmatic and the style is the same, enjoy the music. to me he went for a more mainstream appeal, and failed

SaqurakiHanamichi
08-23-2007, 02:12 PM
Think you mean me bro, well, im guessin anyway

no doubt it has, 50 Cent is now the biggest name in rap. i answered the question in the thread bro, if you think HHID is as good as illmatic and the style is the same, enjoy the music. to me he went for a more mainstream appeal, and failed

but he dident fail man!!! he dident fail!!!!!! what album failed this past 5 years.
and dont go back to nastradamus


lol common dude nas is a playa this is the life is living , when he is gonna talk about jewels its real. U call that mainstream but its real life.


ill rather listen to the new nas over the old nas anyday,
I want another stillmatic

DJMethods
08-23-2007, 02:14 PM
but he dident fail man!!! he dident fail!!!!!! what album failed this past 5 years.
and dont go back to nastradamus

i already answered that brother. hip hop is dead is a massive fail.

thats just me, if you like it, sweet, but i know im not the obly one who only downloaded that then deleted it. a few Nas albums have failed actually, still a legend and one of the greatest of all time.

edit; its not even HIM. i mean, would 36 chambers be good over kanye west beats? no way. the beats are 50% of the album, nas failed that 50% which to me made the other 50% unlistenable. he went a mainstream appeal, which isnt always bad, just is for him

SaqurakiHanamichi
08-23-2007, 02:16 PM
i already answered that brother. hip hop is dead is a massive fail.

thats just me, if you like it, sweet, but i know im not the obly one who only downloaded that then deleted it. a few Nas albums have failed actually, still a legend and one of the greatest of all time.

THANK U!!! THATS ALL I WANTED TO HEAR!


im done!


whoooooooooo! after all this posts

Longbongcilvaringz
08-23-2007, 02:26 PM
damn, i kind of like that nas track for some reason lol.

i dont even have the album.

for some reason i enjoy all nas releases ive got, even nastradamus. for me hes pretty much the ultimate mc... i dunno if hes really sold out though, but i guess you could say there are a number of tracks on recent albums that have been out of place, and have been attempting to appeal to a 'mainstream' audience.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-23-2007, 02:39 PM
thas real.

LuckyTheWonderDog
08-23-2007, 04:07 PM
Moving on is all good. But at least move on in a good direction.

CITY ZEEKER
08-23-2007, 04:30 PM
top of the dome piece:
fat joe
mobb deep
camron
mase

drunken jesus
08-30-2007, 02:08 PM
HHID didn't fail lmao, he sold close to platinum with it, streets disciple only sold gold (its listed as platinum cause its a double album)

& it was received better than illmatic "Aside from Halftime, three moderately popular singles were released in order to promote Illmatic. However, due to widespread bootlegging and a lack of corporate appeal, the album did not do well in terms of record sales."

its obvious his style has changed but definately doesn't have no "oochie wallie" type tracks on it, that track with the girl on you're talking about isn't pop at all, it sounds like some vintage shit

a few come to mind

Mobb Deep - Massive flop after signing with g-unit
Fat Joe - Started drifting more commercial and lost fans steadily, flopped heavily with his last major label album, then he went indie sold half as much and made more money
50 Cent - Biggest name in rap, still sold half as much with his second album which was twice as pop
Mase - Was a successful sellout, went to be a preacher, came back saying he was gonna be positive, he lied, sold out again & flopped
Xzibit - Came out raw, stayed raw for 3 albums, then went pop and started flopping
DPG - Came out raw, stayed raw for a lil while, sold out and flopped their last album didn't even sell 100K i don't think, both of their last solos flopped terribly too
Canibus - Came out raw, fucked with wyclef went pop, flopped, dissappeared, came back a lil more raw, still flops

DJMethods
08-30-2007, 02:10 PM
HHID didn't fail lmao, he sold close to platinum with it, streets disciple only sold gold (its listed as platinum cause its a double album)

& it was received better than illmatic "Aside from Halftime, three moderately popular singles were released in order to promote Illmatic. However, due to widespread bootlegging and a lack of corporate appeal, the album did not do well in terms of record sales."

its obvious his style has changed but definately doesn't have no "oochie wallie" type tracks on it, that track with the girl on you're talking about isn't pop at all, it sounds like some vintage shit

a few come to mind

Mobb Deep - Massive flop after signing with g-unit
Fat Joe - Started drifting more commercial and lost fans steadily, flopped heavily with his last major label album, then he went indie sold half as much and made more money
50 Cent - Biggest name in rap, still sold half as much with his second album which was twice as pop
Mase - Was a successful sellout, went to be a preacher, came back saying he was gonna be positive, he lied, sold out again & flopped
Xzibit - Came out raw, stayed raw for 3 albums, then went pop and started flopping
DPG - Came out raw, stayed raw for a lil while, sold out and flopped their last album didn't even sell 100K i don't think, both of their last solos flopped terribly too
Canibus - Came out raw, fucked with wyclef went pop, flopped, dissappeared, came back a lil more raw, still flops

You're talking 50 shit

benzo
08-30-2007, 06:29 PM
Method Man = The Prequel was a blatant attempt at commercial cross-over appeal.
Jay-Z = After Vol. 1 where did the storytelling go? Vol. 3 started his downfall.
Wu = Come on, Iron Flag is not a good album by any means and the single was staight pop.