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Mic Tyson
06-02-2008, 09:01 PM
Aight guys i want to know what you think on this Very controversial subject about HIV/AIDS. I have found some pretty convincing arguments that AIDS was indeed created.


Quoted from http://www.apfn.org/apfn/aids.htm


"While I do believe that AIDS is a weapon being used by the Federal Fraud Machine (FFM) and its allies, I disagree that it is a contagious disease caused by a little retrovirus, many types which exist in the normal human system. There are hundreds of well known doctors, microbiologists, professors, laymen who have proved that AIDS is not caused by HIV but by drugs end/or other immuno suppresive factors. AIDS is really a psyop weapon that actually gets "the AIDS victim" to kill him or herself. Rather than go into a lengthy and detailed explanation, I suggest you visit www.duesberg.com or aidsmyth.com or virusmyth.com. The AIDS dissidents like Dr. Duesberg, Professor of Microbiology at UC, Kerry Mullis, Noble Prize winner for the PCP test, Walter Gilbert of Harvard, Dr. Charlie Thomas formally at John Hopkins and Harvard, and many others get almost no publicity for their views. Dr. Duesberg has paid for his views by losing a $3 million research contract plus almost all of his other non professor revenues. As he told me "If I would come out and say that maybe HIV is partially responsible for AIDS, I could be paid like an NBA star, like Gallo (who stole the HIV virus from Montagnier) is currently. Now I'll just have to get by on my tenured professor salary." Most of the biological research at Fort Detrick has been bogus and led nowhere. Yet, a lot of people and companies continue to get rich with such research.

The Federal Fraud Machine loves the idea that people think that HIV was a deadly virus concocted at Fort Detrick, since that reinforces the mainstream idea that AIDS is a sexually transmitted disease. The HIV antibody test will show positive if you have a weakened immune system, regardless of whether you have the relatively harmless HIV virus in your system. Since no one has ever isolated this retrovirus, but have confirmed its existence through antibodies, the AIDs test checks for a protein that normally shows up in your blood when you have the flu. Just thonk of all those poor Africans that have been fed the deadly chemotherapy AIDS cocktails that destroy the immune system. Thank heaven for people like Mbeki of South Africa who are not buying the attempted genocide of Africa by the FFM and its allies"




AMERICAN MASSES HOODWINKED

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/aids2.pdf


PROOF- Department of Defense Appropriations for 1970
H.B. 15090

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/aids.pdf




what do u guys think about this

united states patent # 5676977 THE CURE FOR AIDS?

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=5676977.PN.&OS=PN/5676977&RS=PN/5676977

that is the official government patent website.



POST YOUR THOUGHTS

diggy
06-02-2008, 11:25 PM
Thanks for posting this. I have also posted in the past links to the virusmyth and duesbergs' work on this subject.

A growing number of brilliant scientists are now doubting the cause of AIDS, the lethality of hiv, the treatment of hiv drugs, and also the effectiveness of the hiv test!

I suggest people do the research to "Peter Duesberg' on youtube.com and to those links u posted.

Mic Tyson
06-02-2008, 11:38 PM
i can't believe there is a patent for the cure...

SWAMP WATER
06-03-2008, 10:34 AM
Does weed count,as far as cotributing?

WARPATH
06-03-2008, 01:57 PM
Does weed count,as far as cotributing?

Weed doesn't really work with your immune system........

Mic Tyson
06-03-2008, 02:45 PM
the cure is the human immune system when its working at its optimum capacity

please elaborate.

Urban_Journalz
06-03-2008, 02:46 PM
There's a combination of 2 herbs and one spice, that if taken daily for one year, will kill the virus.

I'll post them in a few, because it's in one of my books.

Also, people should also remember Chi Kung. This art is designed to cure any and all ailments of the human body.

Nothing is "incureable", the system would only have you think that, or that they are the only ones with the cure, to keep you slaves to THEIR drugs and pharmacies.

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-03-2008, 02:48 PM
Is AIDS- Aquired Immuno Deficiency Syndrome- caused by a virus? No.

HIV- Human Immunodeficiency Virus- hijacks the immune system by killing off vital T cells (in laymens terms). AIDS is caused by the diminutive number of T cells, and a lowered immune system which allows for opportunistic infections.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now, I am a Biomedical Engineer, so I have SEEN the virus, and I know it is a living being and not a chemical or a drug. BUT, on to the next part of the statement...

Was it created? I believe so. Here's why I think it was created:

As many of you have mentioned, there is a patent for a cure (not just one either!!!). The first "cure" was tested about ten years ago (I don't currently have a link to this study, but I used to show it to my friends up until about 2003 and it disappeared from the net). The results of the studies performed showed that the anti-virus, or "cure" was 75% effective overall... YET it was 95% effective on blacks, Latinos, and South Pacific Asians. It was less than 40% effective on caucasians and mainland Asians including Japanese.

Now, at first glance this may seem strange, but not such a big deal. My problem is that these same groups have blood protein traits that allow us to aquire almost exclusive diseases like sickle cell anemia. An anti-virus would only be effective if certain receptors were present in the cells, and if whites don't have the proper receptors and the anti-virus only works on non-whites this may be an indication that the virus may have only been intended for non-whites. Of course HIV being a mutating virus it would find a way to attach itself to receptors in the cells of whites. But having the proper receptors, non-whites would be more apt to be cured by an anti-virus.

Of course this was just a theory, but the explanation for why the anti-virus worked on non-whites was similar to my accusation... only they excluded the accusations.

There are AIDS drugs that make people's T-cell count go higher than even healthy individuals. Magic Johnson, for example, has a T-cell count 3000% higher than the normal human being... but he has the money to buy the GOOD drugs. As others have stated- the "other" drugs only kill you slowly...

I have an uncle that died of AIDS in 1996.

Mic Tyson
06-03-2008, 03:13 PM
Is AIDS- Aquired Immuno Deficiency Syndrome- caused by a virus? No.

HIV- Human Immunodeficiency Virus- hijacks the immune system by killing off vital T cells (in laymens terms). AIDS is caused by the diminutive number of T cells, and a lowered immune system which allows for opportunistic infections.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now, I am a Biomedical Engineer, so I have SEEN the virus, and I know it is a living being and not a chemical or a drug. BUT, on to the next part of the statement...

Was it created? I believe so. Here's why I think it was created:

As many of you have mentioned, there is a patent for a cure (not just one either!!!). The first "cure" was tested about ten years ago (I don't currently have a link to this study, but I used to show it to my friends up until about 2003 and it disappeared from the net). The results of the studies performed showed that the anti-virus, or "cure" was 75% effective overall... YET it was 95% effective on blacks, Latinos, and South Pacific Asians. It was less than 40% effective on caucasians and mainland Asians including Japanese.

Now, at first glance this may seem strange, but not such a big deal. My problem is that these same groups have blood protein traits that allow us to aquire almost exclusive diseases like sickle cell anemia. An anti-virus would only be effective if certain receptors were present in the cells, and if whites don't have the proper receptors and the anti-virus only works on non-whites this may be an indication that the virus may have only been intended for non-whites. Of course HIV being a mutating virus it would find a way to attach itself to receptors in the cells of whites. But having the proper receptors, non-whites would be more apt to be cured by an anti-virus.

Of course this was just a theory, but the explanation for why the anti-virus worked on non-whites was similar to my accusation... only they excluded the accusations.

There are AIDS drugs that make people's T-cell count go higher than even healthy individuals. Magic Johnson, for example, has a T-cell count 3000% higher than the normal human being... but he has the money to buy the GOOD drugs. As others have stated- the "other" drugs only kill you slowly...

I have an uncle that died of AIDS in 1996.


thanks for that post. i also know someone who is livin with that because her fiancee passed it on to her. shit like that is fucked up.

Urban_Journalz
06-03-2008, 03:20 PM
The combination is black walnut hulls, wormwood and cloves.

BTTR KNG KOOL
06-03-2008, 03:47 PM
Is AIDS- Aquired Immuno Deficiency Syndrome- caused by a virus? No.

HIV- Human Immunodeficiency Virus- hijacks the immune system by killing off vital T cells (in laymens terms). AIDS is caused by the diminutive number of T cells, and a lowered immune system which allows for opportunistic infections.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now, I am a Biomedical Engineer, so I have SEEN the virus, and I know it is a living being and not a chemical or a drug. BUT, on to the next part of the statement...

Was it created? I believe so. Here's why I think it was created:

As many of you have mentioned, there is a patent for a cure (not just one either!!!). The first "cure" was tested about ten years ago (I don't currently have a link to this study, but I used to show it to my friends up until about 2003 and it disappeared from the net). The results of the studies performed showed that the anti-virus, or "cure" was 75% effective overall... YET it was 95% effective on blacks, Latinos, and South Pacific Asians. It was less than 40% effective on caucasians and mainland Asians including Japanese.

Now, at first glance this may seem strange, but not such a big deal. My problem is that these same groups have blood protein traits that allow us to aquire almost exclusive diseases like sickle cell anemia. An anti-virus would only be effective if certain receptors were present in the cells, and if whites don't have the proper receptors and the anti-virus only works on non-whites this may be an indication that the virus may have only been intended for non-whites. Of course HIV being a mutating virus it would find a way to attach itself to receptors in the cells of whites. But having the proper receptors, non-whites would be more apt to be cured by an anti-virus.

Of course this was just a theory, but the explanation for why the anti-virus worked on non-whites was similar to my accusation... only they excluded the accusations.

There are AIDS drugs that make people's T-cell count go higher than even healthy individuals. Magic Johnson, for example, has a T-cell count 3000% higher than the normal human being... but he has the money to buy the GOOD drugs. As others have stated- the "other" drugs only kill you slowly...

I have an uncle that died of AIDS in 1996.

Do u know about the theory of some type of Vaccation somehow(orignally accidentally) causing the mutation of HIV(of some type) to the "deadly type" ?

I dont know much about issue (or the correct terms) but i remember reading an article like that once.

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-03-2008, 04:20 PM
Do u know about the theory of some type of Vaccation somehow(orignally accidentally) causing the mutation of HIV(of some type) to the "deadly type" ?

I dont know much about issue (or the correct terms) but i remember reading an article like that once.

I haven't read that but wouldn't doubt it.

Put it this way:

My stepdad works at Medimmune- the pharmaceutical company that makes Flumist and other drugs. They have a government contract to manufacture a vaccine for Human-Human Avean Flu (the "predicted" pandemic that will occur when avean flu mutates into a virus strain that can pass from human to human; as of now it can only be passed from bird to human, but from then it's not contagious... yet...). The only problem is how do you come up with a solution without a problem??? Well, you know Americans love a preemptive strike... THEY CREATE THE PROBLEM...

They have to contain the problem, so they get away with it by calling it "testing"... but testing on humans is illegal. You have to "accidentally" let the problem out, COME TO THE RESCUE!!! TADADA!!! And "SELL" the solution... They have the solution... so that means they also have the problem.

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-03-2008, 04:21 PM
You can guarantee the FBI will be watching that one... LOL!

BTTR KNG KOOL
06-03-2008, 04:43 PM
I haven't read that but wouldn't doubt it.

Put it this way:

My stepdad works at Medimmune- the pharmaceutical company that makes Flumist and other drugs. They have a government contract to manufacture a vaccine for Human-Human Avean Flu (the "predicted" pandemic that will occur when avean flu mutates into a virus strain that can pass from human to human; as of now it can only be passed from bird to human, but from then it's not contagious... yet...). The only problem is how do you come up with a solution without a problem??? Well, you know Americans love a preemptive strike... THEY CREATE THE PROBLEM...

They have to contain the problem, so they get away with it by calling it "testing"... but testing on humans is illegal. You have to "accidentally" let the problem out, COME TO THE RESCUE!!! TADADA!!! And "SELL" the solution... They have the solution... so that means they also have the problem.

Yea man and especially when u have Nations lining up to buy the Vaccine,, its big money.

BTTR KNG KOOL
06-03-2008, 05:13 PM
You can guarantee the FBI will be watching that one... LOL!

lol


-offtopic

U saying ure Biomedical Engineer takes me way back tho.

my friends dad who is some sort of researcher(Neurovirology, Biotechnology), used to take me and my friend to "his lab" at the local University Hospital to use internet since it wasnt common here at that time..

His dad was researching HIV vaccine, it was like 8-9 years ago. And i think they later came up with somekind of "breakthru"..

I remember some workroom with pieces of brains in a glass jars and they also had a room there with HIV Virus in it, in one of those glass cabin things. And those decontamination showers all over the place and all the crazy ass equipments there.. hahah

Ghost In The 'Lac
06-03-2008, 06:21 PM
this rec drug theory, is this guy taken seriously by anyone? by his ideas, he's basically saying everyone with HIV has got it because theyve taken too much recreational drugs in their life! does he really belieive that? does he really belieive all the 25 million people with HIV were ALL druggies who fucked their immune systems. wtf. someone explain this to me.

diggy
06-04-2008, 01:28 AM
One of the biggest problems is the hiv test.

Do u know that if u take a flu-shot and then have an hiv test a few days to a few weeks after, u will test hiv positive?

Do u know that a pregnant woman who takes a hiv test may test positive?

There are many other conditions that will make u test hiv positive. It is a phenomenon called false (hiv) positives.

Then ask yourself, how many people were told they were positive then were started on taking drug treatments which were cytotoxic ( kills all cells indescriminately - good cells and bad cells)!!!!????

The very treatment for hiv is cytotoxic medications. Do I need to tell u what would happen over many years if a person takes medications that kill all cells indescriminately?



Research for yourself "false (hiv) positives".

diggy
06-04-2008, 01:33 AM
this rec drug theory, is this guy taken seriously by anyone? by his ideas, he's basically saying everyone with HIV has got it because theyve taken too much recreational drugs in their life! does he really belieive that? does he really belieive all the 25 million people with HIV were ALL druggies who fucked their immune systems. wtf. someone explain this to me.

A person is told they are positive after they take the test ( which is greatly flawed).

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-04-2008, 06:48 AM
A person is told they are positive after they take the test ( which is greatly flawed).

-Not all HIV tests are greatly "flawed", only the preliminary ones.

When your blood is tested for HIV, the lab first performs what is known as an EIA or ELISA (enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay). A negative EIA means that no antibodies were found in the blood and that the person is HIV-negative. A positive result is confirmed with a second EIA. If the second EIA is positive, a Western Blot must be done to ensure that the antibodies detected in the EIA test are really HIV antibodies. The Western Blot test can come back positive, negative, or inconclusive.

About 0.2 percent of EIA tests give positive results that are proven false by the Western Blot test. This percentage does not vary between the general population and pregnant women. As noted in an article published in the August 14-28, 2000 Archives of Internal Medicine, an EIA can be falsely positive for several reasons, including a patient's autoimmune disease, multiple pregnancies, blood transfusions, liver diseases, parenteral substance abuse, hemodialysis, or vaccinations for Hepatitis B, rabies, or influenza.

There is a very, very small chance that a Western Blot result is incorrect. False negatives usually happen when people test during the window period. In low-risk groups, a false negative Western Blot result occurs 0.001 percent of the time. False positives occur even less frequently — 0.00001 percent. False positives most often result from volunteers in HIV vaccine studies, clerical error, contaminated specimens, or misinterpretation of the results.

It is important to educate yourself thoroughly on AIDS, HIV, and HIV tests so that you don't anesthetize yourselves to the possibility of it being a real disease causing real harm. The medicines can't give you AIDS- they are designed to boost your T-Cell count which are very important for your immune system. Very few people, if any, are prescribed HIV medicines without the proper testing, and a positive result goes through at least 4 different tests before it is confirmed.

It is one thing to believe in conspiracy, but it is dangerous to teach something potentially harmful to readers when you are not thoroughly educated on the subject...

dezmond
06-04-2008, 12:34 PM
the cure is the human immune system when its working at its optimum capacity

please elaborate.



I remember seein somewhere years ago a report on prostitutes in africa who contracted then killed off HIV or AIDS without drugs....

Dont know where or when it was but the last thing in the report was that western scientists were goin out there to 'study' them...

Anyone else herd this?

diggy
06-04-2008, 07:17 PM
I remember seein somewhere years ago a report on prostitutes in africa who contracted then killed off HIV or AIDS without drugs....

Dont know where or when it was but the last thing in the report was that western scientists were goin out there to 'study' them...

Anyone else herd this?

Yes I heard of this.

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-04-2008, 07:24 PM
I remember seein somewhere years ago a report on prostitutes in africa who contracted then killed off HIV or AIDS without drugs....

Dont know where or when it was but the last thing in the report was that western scientists were goin out there to 'study' them...

Anyone else herd this?

-You're right. These are mostly all "red light district girls" who have worked all their lifes and/or were raised in this environment. This has been found in parts of Asia, Africa, and Eastern Europe. The girls are resistant to HIV, HEP B, HEP C, Syphilis, and other prevalent diseases. In some of these groups, however, you will also find SUPER forms of these diseases, like Black Syphilis in Thailand.

I think there is a mutation of the T cells themselves (and other autoimmune cells) that are stronger than our own. They also may be producing a protein in their bodies that breaks down certain viral cells and allows for the T Cells to attack with better results.

I don't know, these are just theories of why this happens, but I haven't heard any results from the studies... though I have heard of what you're talkin about...

diggy
06-04-2008, 07:36 PM
-Not all HIV tests are greatly "flawed", only the preliminary ones.

When your blood is tested for HIV, the lab first performs what is known as an EIA or ELISA (enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay). A negative EIA means that no antibodies were found in the blood and that the person is HIV-negative. A positive result is confirmed with a second EIA. If the second EIA is positive, a Western Blot must be done to ensure that the antibodies detected in the EIA test are really HIV antibodies. The Western Blot test can come back positive, negative, or inconclusive....

So in other words, the first test could be negative, then the 2nd positive, and the last positive, negative or inconclusive, and after all this, these tests are supposed to be reliable. Truth is truth and error is error, not some of the time, but all of the time. BIG LOOPHOLES IN THESE TESTS.

Another thing, the hiv tests for hiv antibodies not a virus! Do u know what antibodies are. They are proteins that are part of your immune system that fight antigens ( germs).

By the time you have antibodies, the virus is being fought against or is dead. This is what numerous scientist say including Peter Deusberg.


Antibodies contribute to immunity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immunity_%28medical%29) in three main ways: they can prevent pathogens from entering or damaging cells by binding to them; they can stimulate removal of a pathogen by macrophages (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macrophages) and other cells by coating the pathogen; and they can trigger direct pathogen destruction by stimulating other immune responses (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immune_response) such as the complement pathway (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complement_system).


The whole premise of the hiv test is greatly flawed like I have stated before. They test your immune system for antibodies instead of the alleged hiv. Not only that tho, those tests are not definite in their results!

Ghost In The 'Lac
06-05-2008, 01:36 PM
There was also the guy in England who was HIV + and refused all the medication they were giving him and all of a sudden he tested negative. They did all the checks to make sure no mistakes were made in his initial diagnosis, but no mistakes were found, he had all the documentation from when he was diagnosed.

It was about 3 years ago, it made the front page of the newspapers for a while, then I heard nothing about it again, scientists said they were going to study the man, but he was documneted as the first PROVEN person to be completely cured of HIV.

diggy
06-05-2008, 07:04 PM
There was also the guy in England who was HIV + and refused all the medication they were giving him and all of a sudden he tested negative. They did all the checks to make sure no mistakes were made in his initial diagnosis, but no mistakes were found, he had all the documentation from when he was diagnosed.

It was about 3 years ago, it made the front page of the newspapers for a while, then I heard nothing about it again, scientists said they were going to study the man, but he was documneted as the first PROVEN person to be completely cured of HIV.


That man is not the first. There are cases of people who've tested positive for hiv in the U.S., then later on tested negative.

One important thing he did, was refuse the medication. Good job. It's the meds that kill!

Do u know his name? I would like to research that more.

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-05-2008, 07:26 PM
The whole premise of the hiv test is greatly flawed like I have stated before. They test your immune system for antibodies instead of the alleged hiv. Not only that tho, those tests are not definite in their results!

-None of what you said supports your point. The test is not 100% effective, you are absolutely right... what you're wrong about is the prevalence of "false positives" that are not confirmed or denied. Obviously I know what antibodies are, but you don't seem to understand...

Any analysis of chemicals, viruses, or any foreign matter within our blood stream is tested for in its "byproduct" state. For example:

A marijuana unrinalysis tries to prove the metabolization of delta-9-THC (THC or tetrahydrocanabinol 9). The metabolite is 11-nor-delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol-9-carboxylic acid (9-carboxy-THC). Truly positive tests will ony prove positive 95% of the time. There is a 4% false positive prevalence.

When a virus enters the body, chemical signals indicate to white blood cells the protein combination of antibodies that can best destroy or fight the combination of proteins they've detected as foreign. In the case of HIV, a certain protein combination is introduced into the sample of blood, and a color change is expected to indicate a positive. Yes, there are issues with antibodies reacting similarly to other protein combinations, but that doesn't mean the test should not be relied upon to protect yourself and others. If a positive result is detected, the sample is retested using the ELISA process. It is the Western Blot that causes all the controversy, because you are supposed to look for more than one protein combination, which is indicated in bans. There isn't an international standard, so a positive in the Aafrica (2 bands) may not be a positive in the US (3 bands).

Either way, this definitely beats the alternative of not knowing at all...

diggy
06-05-2008, 07:45 PM
It is the Western Blot that causes all the controversy, because you are supposed to look for more than one protein combination, which is indicated in bans. There isn't an international standard, so a positive in the Aafrica (2 bands) may not be a positive in the US (3 bands).

Either way, this definitely beats the alternative of not knowing at all...

Exactly.

I heard this before.

The standard is lower for Africans, which means alot of them will be told they have hiv and put on meds that do more harm than good.

hiv is hiv, right?

Different standards for different continents affirms what I was saying about the test(s) being flawed.

Is there a legitimate reason for the testing of a certain amount and kind of proteins to be less or more in one country to be tested for the hiv or is it just a depopulation program in progress against a group of people?

Mic Tyson
06-05-2008, 08:36 PM
The combination is black walnut hulls, wormwood and cloves.

i was just wondering if this is proven to work, and if it really does why don't a lot of ppl talk about it?

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-06-2008, 05:34 AM
Is there a legitimate reason for the testing of a certain amount and kind of proteins to be less or more in one country to be tested for the hiv or is it just a depopulation program in progress against a group of people?

-Yes. Africans have access to less healthcare, and a lower standard for getting HIV medication is necessary "just in case". It is not true that the medicine is more harmful than the disease itself- that's just ridiculous. There are thousands of Africans who die each year for a lack of healthcare of HIV, and that number is extremely lower in the US. The reason is we have access to better healthcare.

You can play Russina Roulette with your life, but the point is there is no other way of detecting the virus other than this "flawed" method. Remember, to receive a Western Blot (about 75% of the time) you have to go through ELISA. If you were positive in ELISA TWICE, and had two, three, or four bands in Western Blot, don't you think it's better to treat than to die of AIDS??? The average lifespan of someone who is not treated is two years, regardless of the anomalies that have been cured... noone is denying the anomolies- they are being studied. The average lifespan of someone with HIV on medication has grown past ten years, and some say the medication can sustain you indefinitely as it drastically increases your T-Cell count (you think Magic Johnson would rather deny he is HIV positive???)

You can cite a hundred anomolies (you've only cited a few), and that still doesn't touch on the percentage of people who are helped by these tests. I worked in Military Intelligence, so believe me when I tell you I understand conspiracy theories... BUT I have lived through confirmed theories, and I have helped cover up lies that were necessary at the time to protect the country from going to war... I will elaborate since I have never been told this is still classified, and I won't be specific about dates so I don't think the FBI agent sitting at his desk all day will care if I say this- about ten years ago there was a reported commercial aircraft that crashed in the mountains of Colombia. There were passengers cited as having been on board, and there was news coverage of the supposed commercial airline crash. The truth was an ARL (Airborne Reconnaissance Light or Low) was shot down by FARC rebels (actually, I just found mention of it in a discussion about a House bill in 2001 where it is mentioned... I don't think they knew at the time this was covered up, but it was Sept. 1999 and 5 soldiers were killed).

My point is that I know the government does cover ups. BUT you are being a conspiracy theorist where it is not merited. We all know AIDS is a pandemic, we all know there may be cures that have been held from the public, and we all know it may have been created by a government, governments, or a mad scientist. What we don't know is how to detect the virus without the currently used testing procedures. Maybe rather than advocating "not testing", "not diagnosing", and "not prescribing dangerous medicine" you should be advocating "BETTER testing", "better diagnosing", and "better medicine".

TSA
06-06-2008, 01:41 PM
interesting shit

diggy
06-06-2008, 07:16 PM
-Yes. Africans have access to less healthcare, and a lower standard for getting HIV medication is necessary "just in case". It is not true that the medicine is more harmful than the disease itself- that's just ridiculous...


Here is a list of side effects from taking hiv meds:

• Diarrhea
• Feeling tired (fatigue)
• Headache
• Liver problems
• Upset stomach (nausea),

Diarrhea is a common side effect and a person could lose pounds from this. They have to modify their eating habits by eating different foods, avoiding some, and take extra meds so they can lessen it.

Some meds cause anemia ( low red blood cell count). If a person is having constant fatigue, how can they live their life effectively. The patient then again has to take extra meds to increase the red blood cells.

Headaches can also be caused by meds which the person can relieve by taking aspirin. But that stresses the liver which the hiv meds are already doing!

Some hiv meds release too much enzymes which can damage the liver! To treat it, additional meds must be taken.

Upset stomach, vomiting and diarrhea and poor appetite are symptoms of taking hiv meds. Again the patient must take additional meds to relieve it and eat different foods.


Some other side effects are:

• Fat storage problems (lipodystrophy): a change in the way
your body stores fat.

• Metabolic problems: the way your body balances its use of
sugars (glucose), fats, and proteins.

• Heart (cardiovascular) problems: a greater risk of
heart-related illness because of higher fat and cholesterol
levels in your blood.

• Lactic acidosis: your body has unusually high lactic acid
levels, which causes a variety of serious problems.

• Nerve problems (neuropathy): tingling, numbness, or burning
in the fingers or toes that doesn’t go away.

• Blood problems: a low number of different types of
blood cells.

• Bone problems: bones become thinner and break more easily.

• Rash: itching, redness, dry skin, or a reaction to something
in the HIV medication.


http://www.health.state.ny.us/publications/9408.pdf









As for meds being more harmful than the hiv "disease", I suggest u do some research on Peter Deusberg's work on Youtube and on Google.





... Maybe rather than advocating "not testing", "not diagnosing", and "not prescribing dangerous medicine" you should be advocating "BETTER testing", "better diagnosing", and "better medicine".





I agree. But me advocating it is not gonna change the procedure. Top hiv/aids scientists need to recognize the flaw in the system and change it.

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-07-2008, 03:46 PM
Diggy, I'm afraid you are uninformed about the history of AIDS denialists, so I will give you a brief history:

In 1984, the same year the HIV virus was determined to be the "probable" cause of AIDS, a man named Casper Schmidt wrote "The Group-Fantasy Origins of AIDS", which is published by the Journal of Psychohistory. He posits that AIDS is an example of "epidemic hysteria" in which groups of people are subconsciously acting out social conflicts, and compares it to documented cases of epidemic hysteria in the past which were mistakenly thought to be infectious. Schmidt himself died of AIDS in 1994.

In 1987, Peter Duesberg questions the HIV theory of AIDS for the first time in his paper "Retroviruses as Carcinogens and Pathogens: Expectations and Reality", published in the Journal of Cancer Research. This publication coincides with the start of major public health campaigns and the promotion of AZT as a treatment. It was initially administered in much higher dosages than today, typically 400 mg every four hours (even at night). However, the unavailability at that time of alternatives to treat AIDS affected the risk/benefit ratio, with the certain toxicity of HIV infection outweighing the risk of drug toxicity. One of AZT's side effects includes anemia, a common complaint in early trials.

In 1988, A panel of the Institute of Medicine of the United States National Academy of Sciences finds that "the evidence that HIV causes AIDS is scientifically conclusive."

Also in 1988, "Science" published Peter Duesberg's "HIV is not the cause of AIDS". Duesberg has instead proposed the hypothesis that the various American and European diseases identified as AIDS are in fact caused by the long-term consumption of recreational drugs and/or AZT, a drug that is prescribed to prevent or treat AIDS. (For the record, my uncle never used recreational drugs, and wasn't prescribed AZT until he was already dying of AIDS).

In 1988, another group of denialists in Australia claimed that there was no reason to assign AIDS to a retrovirus as there was no conpelling reason to not assign the interactions in the body with that of oxidising agents.

In 1994, 28 October: Robert Willner, a physician whose medical license was revoked for, among other things, treating an AIDS patient with ozone therapy, publicly jabs his finger with blood he says is from an HIV-infected patient. He died the following year of a heart attack (nothing to do with AIDS I don't think...)

in 1998, Valerie Emerson, of Bangor, Maine, prevails in court in Maine for her right to refuse to give AZT to her 4-year-old son Nikolas Emerson, after she witnessed the death of her daughter Tia, who died at the age of 3 in 1996. He died 8 years later of AIDS.

Denialists are anyone from HIV positive persons, to doctors, to government scientists. Duesberg is the most prominent, though his published work has been extensively criticized as outdated (he's been denying since 1987), misinformed, and not thoroughly "fact-checked". Others include David Rasnick (who worked with proteases and is co-holder of several patents on protease inhibitors similar to those used in the treatment of AIDS) and Rodney Richards (who worked at Amgen during the development of some of the first commercial HIV antibody tests).

Critics question the qualifications of dissidents, including those with scientific credentials that have never worked with HIV. Nicoli Nattrass points out that Peter Duesberg has never conducted any scientific research on HIV, and has never presented any evidence that support his claims to a peer-reviewed scientific journal. Nattrass also asserts a lack of understanding of the scientific process on the part of dissidents, such as the Perth Group's Valendar Turner's assertion that that HIV had not been isolated because it had been identified only via the detection of reverse transcription, the process of writing RNA into DNA, which is not unique to retroviruses. Robert Gallo points out that HIV was identified as a retrovirus through the detection of reverse transcriptase, an enzyme unique to retroviruses, and not reverse transcription. Gallo also has criticized Valendar for having conducted no experiments on HIV.

Several prominent scientists who once voiced doubts about HIV/AIDS science have since changed their views and accepted the idea that HIV plays a role in causing AIDS, in response to an accumulation of newer studies and data. Robert Root-Bernstein, author of Rethinking AIDS: The Tragic Cost of Premature Consensus and formerly a critic of the causative role of HIV in AIDS, has since distanced himself from the AIDS denialist movement, saying, "Both the camp that says HIV is a pussycat and the people who claim AIDS is all HIV are wrong...The denialists make claims that are clearly inconsistent with existing studies. When I check the existing studies, I don’t agree with the interpretation of the data, or, worse, I can’t find the studies [at all]."

Joseph Sonnabend, who until the late 1990s regarded the issue of AIDS causation as unresolved, has reconsidered in light of the success of newer antiretroviral drugs, stating, "The evidence now strongly supports a role for HIV... Drugs that can save your life can also under different circumstances kill you. This is a distinction that denialists do not seem to understand." Sonnabend has also criticized AIDS denialists for falsely implying that he supports their position, saying:

Some individuals who believe that HIV plays no role at all in AIDS have implied that I support their misguided views on AIDS causation by including inappropriate references to me in their literature and on their web sites. Before HIV was discovered and its association with AIDS established, I held the entirely appropriate view that the cause of AIDS was then unknown. I have successfully treated hundreds of AIDS patients with antiretroviral medications, and have no doubt that HIV plays a necessary role in this disease.

The magazine Continuum, run by HIV-positive denialists, shut down when its editors all died of AIDS-related causes.

Here is a list of HIV-positive HIV/AIDS denialists who have died from conditions, and with symptoms, characteristic of AIDS:

Ken Anderlini- April, 2007
Fela Anikulapo-Kuti - 1997
Michael Bellefountaine- May, 2007
Sophie Brassard- September, 2002
Ronnie Burk- March, 2003
Sylvie Cousseau- 2001
Mark Griffiths- October, 2004
Robert Johnston- April, 2003
Kelly Jon Landis- December, 2007
Jack Levine- March, 2002
(Jack Levine was a regular poster to the "Virusmyth" message board. When he became sick and began to question denialism, the other board members turned on him, which eventually led to the Virusmyth message board being taken permanently offline in order to hide the appalling record of what happened.)

Raphael Lombardo- June 11, 1996 (a day before my 17th birthday and the same summer my own uncle died of AIDS)- Mr. Lombardo had written to Duesberg about his theories in 1995 after being diagnosed as HIV positive. The letter was titled "Live Without AZT", and there he agreed with Duesberg because he had never used recreational drugs, was not on AZT, was HIV positive, but was not sick. When asked about Lombardo's death, this is what Duesberg wrote: "In hindsight, I think his letter was almost too good to be true. I am afraid now, he described the man he wanted to be [e.g. that he did not use recreational drugs] and his Italian family expected him to be, but not the one he really was. I think he died from Kaposi's." (Source: Email to Richard Jefferys from Peter Duesberg, Wednesday, April 05, 2006)

When this correspondence was published on the internet, Duesberg was contacted by Raphael Lombardo's sister, Regina, who was incensed by Duesberg's claim that her brother had covertly used poppers or other recreational drugs (as Duesberg was implying). Duesberg wrote back to her and told her that she was wrong, too.

Peter Mokaba- 2002
Marietta Ndziba- October, 2005
David Pasquarelli- March, 2004
Casper G. Schmidt- (already mentioned)- 1994
Tony Tompsett- "Continuum"- 1998
Huw Christie Williams- "Continuum"- 2001
Jody Wells- "Continuum"- 1995
Scott Zanetti- October, 2002

These lives, and countless others, could have been saved by the use of prescribed HIV/AIDS medication.

VZA
06-07-2008, 04:16 PM
lol aids

diggy
06-07-2008, 10:53 PM
Here is a list of HIV-positive HIV/AIDS denialists who have died from conditions, and with symptoms, characteristic of AIDS:

Ken Anderlini- April, 2007
Fela Anikulapo-Kuti - 1997
Michael Bellefountaine- May, 2007
Sophie Brassard- September, 2002
Ronnie Burk- March, 2003
Sylvie Cousseau- 2001
Mark Griffiths- October, 2004
Robert Johnston- April, 2003
Kelly Jon Landis- December, 2007
Jack Levine- March, 2002.

Peter Mokaba- 2002
Marietta Ndziba- October, 2005
David Pasquarelli- March, 2004
Casper G. Schmidt- (already mentioned)- 1994
Tony Tompsett- "Continuum"- 1998
Huw Christie Williams- "Continuum"- 2001
Jody Wells- "Continuum"- 1995
Scott Zanetti- October, 2002

These lives, and countless others, could have been saved by the use of prescribed HIV/AIDS medication.


You do not know all of these people's medical histories. You do not know if they were talking other meds which were immune suppressors for symptoms of "what is called aids", which at high doses can allow opportunistic infections to thrive ( like prednisone or corticosteroids).

To say that their lives would be saved by hiv/drugs is not certain.

dezmond
06-08-2008, 11:17 AM
What about the pope still condoning the use of condoms in african cathlics.......

hes basicly saying i know what you could catch but id rather you catch it and die rather than use your intelligence and avoid it.....

why?

Mic Tyson
06-08-2008, 08:27 PM
because the pope is a faggot and wants blacks to keep dying

diggy
06-08-2008, 11:20 PM
What about the pope still condoning the use of condoms in african cathlics.......

hes basicly saying i know what you could catch but id rather you catch it and die rather than use your intelligence and avoid it.....

why?

The pope has no authority to tell people how to live their lives ( people need to decide that for themselves) and any one who takes his words seriously is retarded.

dezmond
06-09-2008, 11:17 AM
retarded.



Thats a very strong word hat youre using there................

I was looking for some more factual reasons......

dezmond
06-09-2008, 11:20 AM
because the pope is a faggot and wants blacks to keep dying



I think that with that response you come across as more of a faggot than the pope........

no condoms equals mor black babies....

discuss

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-09-2008, 05:05 PM
You do not know all of these people's medical histories. You do not know if they were talking other meds which were immune suppressors for symptoms of "what is called aids", which at high doses can allow opportunistic infections to thrive ( like prednisone or corticosteroids).

To say that their lives would be saved by hiv/drugs is not certain.

-Diggy, that is an empty argument. These were avowed AIDS deniers and practitioners of all the advice you are giving. They are your sources. They are the ones that formulated the ideas you are here trying to promote. What makes you think you knew anything they didn't? You are playing a deadly game that they have already paid the price for. Diggy, if you are HIV positive I strongly suggest you reconsider your AIDS denial stance. If you are NOT HIV positive, than I strongly suggest you educate yourself before trying to give medical advice to people who may be adversely affected just as the deceased AIDS deniers I listed.

You have brought no evidence, arguments, studies, ANYTHING supporting your claims, yet I have brought forth mountains of evidence and/or sources to the contrary. You are in no way vested in a true/untrue resolution to this issue, and are instead gambling with the lives of others. I am a healthcare professional, and have had relatives die of AIDS. I am very vested in this issue, researched, and have tested the different sources. You hold all your truths to one man- one who has been discredited by thousands of HIV/AIDS researchers and scientists.

EXPOSEPONCESENT
06-10-2008, 04:50 AM
Aight guys i want to know what you think on this Very controversial subject about HIV/AIDS. I have found some pretty convincing arguments that AIDS was indeed created.


Quoted from http://www.apfn.org/apfn/aids.htm


"While I do believe that AIDS is a weapon being used by the Federal Fraud Machine (FFM) and its allies, I disagree that it is a contagious disease caused by a little retrovirus, many types which exist in the normal human system. There are hundreds of well known doctors, microbiologists, professors, laymen who have proved that AIDS is not caused by HIV but by drugs end/or other immuno suppresive factors. AIDS is really a psyop weapon that actually gets "the AIDS victim" to kill him or herself. Rather than go into a lengthy and detailed explanation, I suggest you visit www.duesberg.com or aidsmyth.com or virusmyth.com. The AIDS dissidents like Dr. Duesberg, Professor of Microbiology at UC, Kerry Mullis, Noble Prize winner for the PCP test, Walter Gilbert of Harvard, Dr. Charlie Thomas formally at John Hopkins and Harvard, and many others get almost no publicity for their views. Dr. Duesberg has paid for his views by losing a $3 million research contract plus almost all of his other non professor revenues. As he told me "If I would come out and say that maybe HIV is partially responsible for AIDS, I could be paid like an NBA star, like Gallo (who stole the HIV virus from Montagnier) is currently. Now I'll just have to get by on my tenured professor salary." Most of the biological research at Fort Detrick has been bogus and led nowhere. Yet, a lot of people and companies continue to get rich with such research.

The Federal Fraud Machine loves the idea that people think that HIV was a deadly virus concocted at Fort Detrick, since that reinforces the mainstream idea that AIDS is a sexually transmitted disease. The HIV antibody test will show positive if you have a weakened immune system, regardless of whether you have the relatively harmless HIV virus in your system. Since no one has ever isolated this retrovirus, but have confirmed its existence through antibodies, the AIDs test checks for a protein that normally shows up in your blood when you have the flu. Just thonk of all those poor Africans that have been fed the deadly chemotherapy AIDS cocktails that destroy the immune system. Thank heaven for people like Mbeki of South Africa who are not buying the attempted genocide of Africa by the FFM and its allies"




AMERICAN MASSES HOODWINKED

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/aids2.pdf


PROOF- Department of Defense Appropriations for 1970
H.B. 15090

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/aids.pdf




what do u guys think about this

united states patent # 5676977 THE CURE FOR AIDS?

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=5676977.PN.&OS=PN/5676977&RS=PN/5676977

that is the official government patent website.



POST YOUR THOUGHTS

I'll post my thoughts on this later, but duesberg was one of the people working on the man made AIDS virus as shown in the US Special Cancer Virus Program documents, so you have to take some of his shit wit a pinch of salt. i'll post the relevant information later when i have the time

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-10-2008, 12:11 PM
I'll post my thoughts on this later, but duesberg was one of the people working on the man made AIDS virus as shown in the US Special Cancer Virus Program documents, so you have to take some of his shit wit a pinch of salt. i'll post the relevant information later when i have the time

-What Duesberg was working on was AZT which was supposed to be a cure for cancer. When AIDS was identified as blaming a retrovirus- HIV- AZT was tapped and worked in lab studies. Duesberg was against the use of AZT for HIV because he is a cancer researcher, amongst other things. I would like to see what evidence you have that he worked on a man-made AIDS virus.

diggy
06-10-2008, 01:28 PM
-Diggy, that is an empty argument.

No it's not. You cannot make a conclusion as to why someone died without looking at what may have caused their death.

You have brought no evidence, arguments, studies, ANYTHING supporting your claims, yet I have brought forth mountains of evidence and/or sources to the contrary.

I have brought forth many arguments, and to support my claim I've stated at the beginning that people should do their own research.

You hold all your truths to one man- one who has been discredited by thousands of HIV/AIDS researchers and scientists.

Yes they have discredited him, but they have not done so in an scientifical fashion thru proofs to put the issue to rest.

.

Mic Tyson
06-10-2008, 03:28 PM
no condoms equals mor black babies....

discuss

who could be infected genius. then whats the fuckin point?

WuLatino- MANGANI
06-11-2008, 09:39 AM
You cannot make a conclusion as to why someone died without looking at what may have caused their death.

-Their health history was public record as most of these people made their infections, regimens of self-medication, philosophies, etc. very public. These are the people (or group) you have been referencing in referencing Duesberg who constantly used these people as an example. When they die he makes things up about their history, as I showed in a previous post.

I have brought forth many arguments, and to support my claim I've stated at the beginning that people should do their own research.

-You provided one argument from one discredited source. Of course people should do their own research, but you brought up the topic and the successive arguments in favor of your premise. That's like saying- the moon is made of cheese... hey, I'm just saying... you do your own research.

Yes they have discredited him, but they have not done so in an scientifical fashion thru proofs to put the issue to rest.

-Noone does anything in a "scientifical" fashion, rather they published articles, studies, and peer reviewed essays in opposition to his claims. The scientific community has reached a consensus and signed a declaration discrediting him for his lack of hands on research in the areas he claims others are misinformed. His essays are published, and not generally backed up by anyone other than people like the ones on the list I provided of HIV positive AIDS deniers who have died of auto-immune deficiency related diseases (happy?).

http://www.sciencemag.org/feature/data/cohen/266-5191-1642a.pdf
http://www.tac.org.za/Documents/ErrorsInFarberArticle.pdf
http://www.aidstruth.org/inventing.php
http://www.sciencemag.org/feature/data/cohen/cohen.dtl
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durban_declaration

...although the Berkeley virologist raises provocative questions, few researchers find his basic contention that HIV is not the cause of AIDS persuasive. Mainstream AIDS researchers argue that Duesberg’s arguments are constructed by selective reading of the scientific literature, dismissing evidence that contradicts his theses, requiring impossibly definitive proof, and dismissing outright studies marked by inconsequential weaknesses.- John Cohen

Duesberg has been discredited by the Durban Declaration, signed by over 5000 scientists and physicians.

EXPOSEPONCESENT
06-12-2008, 02:19 PM
-What Duesberg was working on was AZT which was supposed to be a cure for cancer. When AIDS was identified as blaming a retrovirus- HIV- AZT was tapped and worked in lab studies. Duesberg was against the use of AZT for HIV because he is a cancer researcher, amongst other things. I would like to see what evidence you have that he worked on a man-made AIDS virus.

Check these previous links were i break it all down about duesberg and the man made AIDS virus

http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51882

http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49932

here's a pasted link from healthy world message about Dr. Duesberg and Dr. Leonard Horowitz scheduled point/counterpoint debate on nationally syndicated Genesis Communications Network on Thursday, May 22, 2008...

HIV Denier Duesberg Scheduled
To Debate Horowitz
From Healthy World Message
5-21-8

AIDS CRIMINAL DUESBERG CONCURS WITH GENOCIDALIST GALLO ON SPECIAL VIRUS CANCER PROGRAM DURING 1973 CONFERENCE


In the aftermath of Rev. Jeremiah Wright's accusation that AIDS is a man-made genocidal weapon targeting mainly minority people, the matter of whether HIV-1, the "AIDS virus," even exists has returned to the political center stage.

There are many people, like medical writers Peter Barry Chowka and Gary Null, who advance Dr. Peter Duesberg's theory that HIV-1 has nothing to do with AIDS. They complain of a massive cover-up directed by drug industrialists who profit from people popping pills to cure the many ills associated with the pandemic that has killed approximately 40 million people.

Duesberg proponents degrade anyone alleging that the virus even exists, a step beyond what even Duesberg argues. He says gay lifestyles and drug side effects are the root causes of the pandemic, and that most Third World victims are killed by diseases unrelated to AIDS or HIV.

Their argument is "standard counterintelligence propaganda," says Dr. Leonard Horowitz, among the most libeled authorities in public health. Dr. Horowitz wrote the book, Emerging Viruses: AIDS & Ebola--Nature, Accident or Intentional? that Rev. Wright says evidences his charge that AIDS is an Anglo-American conspiracy.

"This conspiracy centers on Duesberg and his infamous collaborator, Dr. Robert Gallo, the alleged AIDS-virus discoverer," Dr. Horowitz explains. "If you simply read their Special Virus Cancer Program contracts, and conference exchanges, you can learn the truth."

In 1973, for example, Duesberg was asked by Gallo whether the genetic "Hot Spot" that caused cells to become cancerous was responding to an external or internal virus-like particle. As reprinted in Horowitz's book, Duesberg replied, "I think there is little doubt that Rous SV [mouse sarcoma virus] or AMV [bird virus] can be the cause of cancer." Today Duesberg denies ever saying this.

". . . [A]t least they cause chicken cancer," Gallo added. "I think the information for carcinogensis may be packaged into only very special type-C RNA tumor viruses . . . which are oncogenic such as the wooly monkey simian sarcoma virus."

"That is absolutely right." Duesberg replied.

In essence, Gallo stated, and Duesberg acknowledged, that only "very special" retroviruses could be expected to produce AIDS-like immunosuppression and cancers, as this had already been proven in monkeys and other animals. In fact, AIDS-like viruses, they agreed, caused cancers in chickens and monkeys before they were modified to infect humans--the main purpose of the massive, yet secreted, Special Virus Cancer [Research] Program in which Gallo and Duesberg collaborated. Their contracts are reprinted in Horowitz's Emerging Viruses: AIDS & Ebola book.

What Gallo did to monkeys, Duesberg did to chickens. Then they compared their cancer inductions. Both were paid a lot of money to create in their labs the very special viruses containing the very special enzyme, RNA-dependent DNA polymerase (i.e, Reverse Transcriptase), that produced the never-before-seen leukemia-lymphoma-sarcoma cancer complex associated with immune system failure. Then Gallo's team got these viral mutants to jump species into humans.

From there, Horowitz evidences, Gallo's team sent these very special viruses to New York and Philadelphia in chimpanzees used to produce the 1972-74 hepatitis B vaccines given to gay men in New York, villagers in Central Africa, and Willowbrook State School mentally retarded children on Staten Island. The rest is well known history, including the sudden closure of Willowbrook in 1976 due to documented "child abuse" by school officials who collaborated with researchers under a U.S. Army "experimental" vaccine research contract.

The significance of Duesberg's contract was said to "provide important insight into the mechanism by which RNA tumor viruses bring about malignant transformation, and . . . the understanding of the causation and control of human neoplastic disease [i.e., cancer.]

Duesberg's contract was dated June, 1971, the precise time Henry Kissinger was advancing his African foreign policy depopulation strategy historically documented in the now declassified National Security Memorandum 200.

Most people might consider this political history as unrelated to Duesberg and Gallo's collaboration in developing "special" viruses. (By the way, the word "special" in military circles connotes "secret.") The fact is, however, the private company that paid their salaries was directed by Dr. Kissinger's White House colleague managing American industry, Roy Ash. Ash, the past president of Litton Industries, a major military weapons contractor, is currently a major Republican Party financier.

Roy Ash's company, Litton Industries, owned Litton Bionetics, the Army's sixth top biological weapons contractor during the early 1970s. Gallo and Duesberg were both paid by Bionetcs, and Gallo received his monkeys and chimpanzees from them as well. This is why the human AIDS virus, HIV-1, is so much like the chimpanzee strain of AIDS (i.e., SIVcpz) common sense explains.

"So Duesberg is simply covering-up his intimate association with the people, program, and political policy that generated our global AIDS tragedy," Dr. Horowitz concludes.

"Wright, Horowitz, and [Boyd Ed] Graves believe that HIV is an infectious virus, that it's sexually transmitted, that it causes AIDS, and that AIDS is fatal. Horowitz and Graves do question the origin of HIV, that's their main deviation. And to some extent they question the toxicity of AIDS drugs, but they also have a financial conflict of interest, both pushing their own silver-based compounds (Tetrasilver for Graves, Oxysilver for Horowitz)," wrote Peter Barry Chowka, proudly citing his employ at the National Institutes of Health while alleging his reliability as a AIDS dissident.

"Chowka is a downright lier," Horowitz replied. "He never once interviewed me, yet condemns me publicly for his fabrications." Yes, I do believe HIV is an infectious virus. Any vaccine-inoculated pathogen is infectious by definition. Inject a virus into your computer and see what happens. Only morons and propagandists claim HIV, a foreign man-made virus, injected into the human body is 'harmless.'"

Chowka also lied when he claimed Dr. Horowitz believes HIV is sexually transmitted. "I never once said this, or wrote this, since I believe HIV is primarily vaccine transmitted," Dr. Horowitz defended. "And I believe 'sexual transmission' is a distraction from vaccination genocide. It blames victims of AIDS rather than those responsible for creating it for profit and population control."

Chowka lied again when he said that Dr. Horowitz believes HIV "causes AIDS." For years the author of Emerging Viruses: AIDS & Ebola--Nature, Accident or Intentional?, and fifteen other books, has repeatedly published the cause of AIDS as mycoplasma, not HIV--a relatively weak immune suppressor.

And Chowka libeled Dr. Horowitz alleging "financial conflict of interest" for "pushing" OXYSILVER while neglecting to disclose the massive peer reviewed science proving the silver hydrosols kill HIV and make all vaccinations, toxic immunizations, and poisonous expensive antibiotics obsolete.

Boyd Ed Graves was also libeled by Chowka for "pushing" Tetrasil, another proven HIV remedy. Graves, an attorney who recovered from AIDS by volunteering for a study in which Tetrasil was prescribed orally, has been critical of officials ever since, protesting the suppression of natural cures for AIDS, including oxygenation therapies.

Graves and Horowitz both deplore the federal government's failure to make public these readily available AIDS cures.

Dr. Horowitz explains most AIDS deaths are caused by secondary infections totally preventable and treatable with low cost covalently-bonded silver hydrosols taken internally. HisOXYSILVER recommendation costs less than $5 per ounce, whereas drug industrialists charge 20 times this amount for an inferior silver hydrosol product used in AIDS and cancer clinics to save terminally ill patients.

Dr. Duesberg and Dr. Horowitz are scheduled for a point/counterpoint debate on nationally syndicated Genesis Communications Network on Thursday, May 22, 2008 at 11AM EST


...I'm more in line wit lawyer and AIDS activist Boyd Graves(the guy who has taken the AIDS cure in 2001 and his health improved tremendulously. The cure was patented in US courts in 1997 as a cure for AIDS called Imusil/Tetrasil, patent no. 5676977 by rabbi Marvin S Antelman & the Marantech Organization but there website has been down since 2005 and its impossible to get hold of the rabbi, they had repeatedly given people the run around even though they had successuful trials of the cure in Mexico in 1996 and as recently as 2004 in central Africa. Boyd was told that the rabbi went to uni wit Dr. Robert Gallo, who was the case officer for the US goverments US Special Cancer Virus Program, from 1962 to 1978, the program we believe created the AIDS virus, Boyd was told that Gallo gave the cure to the rabbi as compensation for an idea that he had previously stolen from the rabbi at uni, as payback. We believe there holding back the cure for population control reasons. But Boyd has copied the patent and has tried to release it himself)& Professor Donald W Scott's line of thinking, I am a AIDS researcher too and my research seems to fit in wit there work

V4D3R
06-12-2008, 04:49 PM
http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=34&contentid=1377&page=2

diggy
06-12-2008, 08:55 PM
http://www.hiv-aids-factorfraud.com/

Robert
06-13-2008, 05:58 AM
-Their health history was public record as most of these people made their infections, regimens of self-medication, philosophies, etc. very public. These are the people (or group) you have been referencing in referencing Duesberg who constantly used these people as an example. When they die he makes things up about their history, as I showed in a previous post.



-You provided one argument from one discredited source. Of course people should do their own research, but you brought up the topic and the successive arguments in favor of your premise. That's like saying- the moon is made of cheese... hey, I'm just saying... you do your own research.



-Noone does anything in a "scientifical" fashion, rather they published articles, studies, and peer reviewed essays in opposition to his claims. The scientific community has reached a consensus and signed a declaration discrediting him for his lack of hands on research in the areas he claims others are misinformed. His essays are published, and not generally backed up by anyone other than people like the ones on the list I provided of HIV positive AIDS deniers who have died of auto-immune deficiency related diseases (happy?).

http://www.sciencemag.org/feature/data/cohen/266-5191-1642a.pdf
http://www.tac.org.za/Documents/ErrorsInFarberArticle.pdf
http://www.aidstruth.org/inventing.php
http://www.sciencemag.org/feature/data/cohen/cohen.dtl
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durban_declaration

...although the Berkeley virologist raises provocative questions, few researchers find his basic contention that HIV is not the cause of AIDS persuasive. Mainstream AIDS researchers argue that Duesberg’s arguments are constructed by selective reading of the scientific literature, dismissing evidence that contradicts his theses, requiring impossibly definitive proof, and dismissing outright studies marked by inconsequential weaknesses.- John Cohen

Duesberg has been discredited by the Durban Declaration, signed by over 5000 scientists and physicians.

Thanks for breaking it down for diggy as I tried to do in another thread.

Robert
06-13-2008, 06:01 AM
http://www.hiv-aids-factorfraud.com/

Duesberg is a fraud not HIV/AIDS. Stop with the nonsense already.

EXPOSEPONCESENT
06-13-2008, 08:39 AM
http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=34&contentid=1377&page=2

Props for these links, even though i don't agree wit some of Dr.Alan Cantwell conclusions and points to how AIDS came about and I think he is a pussy for not backing up Boyd Graves in his court case against the US goverment for the creation of AIDS, but he is a valued AIDS researcher, netherless

Longbongcilvaringz
06-13-2008, 09:17 AM
An interesting read all.