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View Full Version : "The DSM-IV: Inventing Mental Illness"


Mr. Muhammad
05-13-2009, 03:42 PM
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For more info, visit:

CAERing Solutions
http://caeringsolutions.webs.com/psycheologyhijacked.htm

RM

diggy
05-13-2009, 04:52 PM
Good thread.

Imo, most problems, if not all, are spiritual in nature.

Mr. Muhammad
05-13-2009, 05:42 PM
Good thread.

Imo, most problems, if not all, are spiritual in nature.

Indeed, and this is just the "tip" of a very large "iceberg"...

The root of it all is a spiritual problem which eventually manifests on the physical plane.

If the illness is inorganic (mental), then the cure must likewise be inorganic (mental). Introducing chemicals to solve a mental problem only suppresses the symptoms...but does nothing to neutralize or remove the cause(s).

RM

TSA
05-13-2009, 09:52 PM
anyways.



There are medicines, because of the study of psychiatry, that help someone deal with schitzophrenia.


if you knew what schitzophrenia was like (and you probably do) to call anything trying to cure this disorder which i would classify as worst then AIDs cause in the end of the day your barely alive and can end up killing yourself and people around you.

some people walk into a room and literally hear every voice they've ever heard in their life at the same time, with one, for years, telling them to kill themselves.



some people go to war can come back with the inability to sleep, eat, or hear loud noises without feeling like someone is trying to kill them.


some people come break from getting picked on and feel this way

some people have had parents how have made them want to die.
and go through their adult life projecting this feeling on themselves through self multilation or suicide, or inflicting it on their kids and people around them.


i know a 13 year old girl whos mother constantly abuses because she needs psychiatric help. Just constantly tell this girl, virgin mind you, that she's a whore and is good for nothing.

when CPS was called on the women, the girls arms, 13 mind you, was covered every inch with massive, deep red gashes from a knief.


came to find out that the girl did it to herself and it's sad cause she's a very pretty young lady.







a field of science was invented to help this sicknesses and now your trying to claim that these very real live problems that ppl go through day to day and that are all around us killing billions of people or keeping them trapped in a controlness state are made up in a book?

when there's people who (true story, not really unbelieveable), kill their dad and eat their dad's brain because jesus was living inside his dad's brain.

the field has been immensely successful in curing these ailments and spotting them and has taken humanity very far.
since it's still in its infancy i believe it will continue to do so and is the most important science known to man today because everything is mental concerning human beings, we're just extensions of our brain and striving to understand this brain is not a sin, or an effort that should be condemn.

TSA
05-13-2009, 10:01 PM
imo, i don't believe these things, as 'crazy' as they sound should be called disorders.

2+1 = 3

1- 1 = 0

8 + 8 = 16


are all different in every way from result to equation, but they're still called functions of each other.

what psychology is essentially doing is saying that 1 + 1 = 2 is a function and every single other equation is a disfunction.


sure this wierd behavior doesn't seem to 'make sense' but there always a reason for it, and so long as there's reason it's a function of something, so calling it a disorder is really hindering the scientific accuracy of the field and its a widely shared opinion.

Olive Oil Goombah
05-13-2009, 10:35 PM
there is no reason to doubt pyschology at all.

diggy
05-13-2009, 11:11 PM
Indeed, and this is just the "tip" of a very large "iceberg"...

The root of it all is a spiritual problem which eventually manifests on the physical plane.

If the illness is inorganic (mental), then the cure must likewise be inorganic (mental). Introducing chemicals to solve a mental problem only suppresses the symptoms...but does nothing to neutralize or remove the cause(s).

RM


Yes.



The inventors of psychiatry were probably spiritually bereft. I say this cuz they (like you have said) use chemicals to solve a problem of spiritual origin. They probably view the human body as a container of liquids and chemical reactions denying the spiritual aspect of life. They only see the obvious. How could a person who only sees a portion of what we are, solve an issue that originates in an aspect of being they do not recognize?

If a human is just a container of liquids and chemical reactions, they (doctors) should be able to inject a dead body with the right chemicals and bring it back to life, but they can't do it. So life is more than chemical reactions. I know this is another topic, but I just wanted to add on.

TSA
05-13-2009, 11:18 PM
Yes.



The inventors of psychiatry were probably spiritually bereft. I say this cuz they (like you have said) use chemicals to solve a problem of spiritual origin. They probably view the human body as a container of liquids and chemical reactions denying the spiritual aspect of life. They only see the obvious. How could a person who only sees a portion of what we are, solve an issue that originates in an aspect of being they do not recognize?

If a human is just a container of liquids and chemical reactions, they (doctors) should be able to inject a dead body with the right chemicals and bring it back to life, but they can't do it. So life is more than chemical reactions. I know this is another topic, but I just wanted to add on.
its also a very intricate system of energy set points and complex chemical balances that's near impossible to replicate due to that fact that it's the cohesion that trillions of cells with their own life.


again idk why you would believe in spirits and not believe in ghosts

unless you believe in ghosts, cause they're literally the same thing.

diggy
05-13-2009, 11:33 PM
Very intricate indeed and that points to a designer of supreme wisdom and power.

To me spirit and ghost is different. Ghosts are attributed to strange noises and images living people cannot explain. I do not believe in them.

diggy
05-13-2009, 11:35 PM
there is no reason to doubt pyschology at all.

There is reason. Did you watch the video?

TSA
05-13-2009, 11:43 PM
Very intricate indeed and that points to a designer of supreme wisdom and power.

To me spirit and ghost is different. Ghosts are attributed to strange noises and images living people cannot explain. I do not believe in them.
or not.
what if its intricate cause it's intricate? after all its trillions of cells living mutually and coordinating with chemical set points and kinetic energy.
it would get intricate. and that's just the cellular level. atoms are triller.


and a spirit is a ghost, that's all. ghost is a synonum (could never spell that word, not greek) for spirit, there's no different.

TSA
05-13-2009, 11:47 PM
Indeed, and this is just the "tip" of a very large "iceberg"...

The root of it all is a spiritual problem which eventually manifests on the physical plane.

If the illness is inorganic (mental), then the cure must likewise be inorganic (mental). Introducing chemicals to solve a mental problem only suppresses the symptoms...but does nothing to neutralize or remove the cause(s).

RM
also, mental illnesses are organic, or chemical, and are thus treated best with chemicals.

TSA
05-13-2009, 11:54 PM
anyways, though i believe that yes, therapy can be effective, i believe it should only serve as a subsidiary to medication (as is the commonly held, but still debated practice)

if there is a failure to reach a chemical set point needed to conduct 'normal behavior', then i don't see the problem is give the person whatever chemical they're deficient of, like with medication of any and all other illnesses, and because the brain is all chemcial and energy reactions i think that medication over therapy is key but therapy is still essential obviously, and should always be used.

diggy
05-13-2009, 11:59 PM
What caused the chemical imbalance in the first place. (excuse the underline - not on purpose)

diggy
05-14-2009, 12:02 AM
Sometimes mental imbalance is caused when one tries to do spiritual exercises without guidance.

I had a convo with someone that had done a spiritual excercise and was left with mental illness. Truth.

TSA
05-14-2009, 12:15 AM
What caused the chemical imbalance in the first place. (excuse the underline - not on purpose)

thousands of reasons that aren't a mystery to anyone that studies them
gland problems, inability to make certain chemicals, making too much of a chemical, getting a chemical reaction from things you shouldn't (dopamine from watching babies get killed, adrenaline from burning houses ect.), nerve damage, your health, your diet, your sleep patterns, interactions with others, genetic disposition, and more.

diggy
05-14-2009, 12:49 AM
Ok, you've named some exact causes for some.

But for other symptoms like making too much chemical or gland problems, there are causes for that too that doctors need to address in a non-chemical way.

You could be right that types of food and patterns of sleep could alter chemicals in the human body. If that is the case the solution should not be a chemical, but finding balance with food or sleep to restore mental order.

TSA
05-14-2009, 12:56 AM
Ok, you've named some exact causes for some.

But for other symptoms like making too much chemical or gland problems, there are causes for that too that doctors need to address in a non-chemical way.

You could be right that types of food and patterns of sleep could alter chemicals in the human body. If that is the case the solution should not be a chemical, but finding balance with food or sleep to restore mental order.
why?

if your body lacks dopamine cause you flat out can't produce it, why not take a tablet of it or a substance that will work as a catalysis for dopamine production?

i dare you to tell a person in deep dementia to meditate his way out of it, or that he's eating the wrong stuff.


diet effects mood, energy, and various other things that don't touch the tip of the iceberg for a schitzophrenic

a lot of people with mania have extraordinary eating a sleeping habits, wont stop him from buying everything green at JCPennys on his credit card. it's bigger then hip hop.

Longbongcilvaringz
05-14-2009, 06:44 PM
x-unknown (http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/member.php?u=16918) you idiot.

Medication is always used in combination with other treatment such a counseling and rehabilitation in the extreme cases which you are referring to.

I'd say you were the "guy you know" who attempted spiritual awakening and returned with a mental illness.

Koolish
05-14-2009, 07:25 PM
i heard in the east, when you have a medical problem, the doctor's look at your mind first (how are you lately, what's been happening in your life recently).

TSA
05-14-2009, 08:30 PM
Sometimes mental imbalance is caused when one tries to do spiritual exercises without guidance.

I had a convo with someone that had done a spiritual excercise and was left with mental illness. Truth.
.

diggy
05-14-2009, 09:27 PM
i heard in the east, when you have a medical problem, the doctor's look at your mind first (how are you lately, what's been happening in your life recently).


I think this is a more rightful approach to solving medical problems.

TSA
05-14-2009, 09:36 PM
like AIDs?

diggy
05-14-2009, 09:41 PM
Maybe I should have been specific. I was thinking of mental illness not all illnesses.

EAGLE EYE
05-14-2009, 09:44 PM
jesus price why did i open this thread.

TSA
05-14-2009, 09:46 PM
Maybe I should have been specific. I was thinking of mental illness not all illnesses.
that's what they do for mental illness...it's called counseling...

diggy
05-14-2009, 10:05 PM
True, but western counseling usually ends with a prescription for pills.

I am against unnecessary pill-taking.

TSA
05-14-2009, 11:00 PM
?

no it doesn't.


i worked for a counseling firm.


counselors can't prescribe

EAGLE EYE
05-15-2009, 12:29 AM
my friend works with extremely mentally ill people. with out their medication they would be in a world of hurt. imagine having schizophrenia, retardation, and I believe epilepsy all at once.. I met that patient a few times..

he was a vegetable

TSA
05-15-2009, 12:39 AM
you should tell him to get more sleep.

diggy
05-15-2009, 03:31 AM
To sum up, all I'm saying is that modern medicine does not address the causes of ailments, but treats their symptoms.

I believe research should go into finding causes to the problems you've mentioned. But then again, there is lots of money to be made by not finding causes and only treating symptoms.

TSA
05-15-2009, 10:26 AM
name a modern medicine that does address the cause of ailments.
I have a feeling you just attacking medicine (wow) without any real information on any real medicines for ailments worth attacking.

also if there's some with an unexplained mental illness that causes them to constantly hear a painful ringing in their head, that's wrong with treating that symptom?


what's wrong with treating any symptom? are they bad for trying to help a person live a more comfortable life?

diggy
05-15-2009, 03:42 PM
name a modern medicine that does address the cause of ailments.

Are you dumb?

I've just told you 'modern medicine' does not address the cause of ailments, and now you are telling me to name a 'modern medicine' which addresses the cause of ailments.

Please re-read what I have wrote and your response to it to fully understand what you did not understand the first time!

BornPower
05-15-2009, 04:47 PM
also, mental illnesses are organic, or chemical, and are thus treated best with chemicals.

anyways, though i believe that yes, therapy can be effective, i believe it should only serve as a subsidiary to medication (as is the commonly held, but still debated practice)

if there is a failure to reach a chemical set point needed to conduct 'normal behavior', then i don't see the problem is give the person whatever chemical they're deficient of, like with medication of any and all other illnesses, and because the brain is all chemcial and energy reactions i think that medication over therapy is key but therapy is still essential obviously, and should always be used.

medication is nothing more than minerals and salts used to nudge one's chemical balance one way or another. if one were to get the minerals and salts needed from their diet as opposed to the pills u are so quick to pop then the "medication" being sold by the medical "professionals" (it's still a BUSINESS TO THEM, meditate on that) would not be needed.
The therapy you are so quick to dismiss is merely guidance (from a QUALIFIED individual) that we all need. If our family structure was truly supportive then we would have this in our lives.

why?

if your body lacks dopamine cause you flat out can't produce it, why not take a tablet of it or a substance that will work as a catalysis for dopamine production?

i dare you to tell a person in deep dementia to meditate his way out of it, or that he's eating the wrong stuff.


diet effects mood, energy, and various other things that don't touch the tip of the iceberg for a schitzophrenic

a lot of people with mania have extraordinary eating a sleeping habits, wont stop him from buying everything green at JCPennys on his credit card. it's bigger then hip hop.

even IF one were balanced in form and function, u must understand that we all have issues we need to work our in our own time/space, and part of our test is HOW we resolve these issues.

There is NO way I would let these so-called medical professionals dope my daughter up cuz they think she is "bi-polar" or ADHD, or any of these other so-called diseases. Would u allow them to drug you and your children and brainwash you?
That's what you ask them to do with the meds and therapy....

TSA
05-15-2009, 06:07 PM
i can't wait till you get aids and someone tells you to eat better.

Somewhat Healthy
05-16-2009, 09:44 PM
Well, this just happens to be the one topic that made me stop browsing and just create an account.



There is NO way I would let these so-called medical professionals dope my daughter up cuz they think she is "bi-polar" or ADHD, or any of these other so-called diseases. Would u allow them to drug you and your children and brainwash you?
That's what you ask them to do with the meds and therapy....

Are you denying that such diseases exist? Or are you arguing with the diagnosis?
Simply denying that any biological influences exist is a biased assumption.
But, as Unknown-x said in a few posts above me, for certain illnesses, having a psychiatrist prescribe medication to merely reduce the severity of the symptoms is quite frankly very lackadaisical.
I believe that medication is essential when you are certain that chemical imbalances etc. actually are directly CAUSING the maladaptive behaviors.
There are so many different types mental disorders that not one type of treatment is necessarily more effective than another.

Longbongcilvaringz
05-17-2009, 10:40 PM
Why are you assuming that these illnesses can be reversed?

How have you come to the conclusion that by identifying the causes of schizophrenia you can some how just 'cure' it.

Quite frankly, you have no idea what you're talking about, and by using vague and imprecise terms such as "spirituality" this thread is quickly becoming a farce.

Which is a shame, because maybe there are serious problems with the way people are medicated today.

I guess it's easier to make an incorrect, sweeping generalisation, than to consider a middle ground.

Fucking imbeciles.

TSA
05-17-2009, 11:16 PM
im not saying there's nothing wrong with medicine.

im saying diggy needs medicine.

LORD NOSE
05-17-2009, 11:23 PM
Fucking imbeciles.




calm down son

diggy
05-17-2009, 11:32 PM
The ones who ruin threads are always the same.

diggy
05-17-2009, 11:38 PM
Why are you assuming that these illnesses can be reversed?

How have you come to the conclusion that by identifying the causes of schizophrenia you can some how just 'cure' it.

If the individual did not have the illness at an earlier period of life, but acquired it later (in life), then attempting to reverse the illness is a reasonable response.

People develop schizophrenia over time. I have not heard of anyone born with it. So if it could be acquired, then again, it is reasonable to try to bring the person back to their normal (pre-schizoid) state.



Quite frankly, you have no idea what you're talking about, and by using vague and imprecise terms such as "spirituality" this thread is quickly becoming a farce.

Which is a shame, because maybe there are serious problems with the way people are medicated today.

I guess it's easier to make an incorrect, sweeping generalisation, than to consider a middle ground.

Fucking imbeciles.



Did you watch the video or did you come into this thread to DESTROY arguments out of hatred and anger?

Longbongcilvaringz
05-18-2009, 01:45 AM
People don't strictly develop Schizophrenia because of experience, in most cases there is a predisposition towards mental illness.

Again, you know nothing about mental illness and the treatment of it.

Your now trying to in a way make generalisations about schizophrenia and mental illness from ideas and observations which you have developed. Saying something like "it is reasonable to try to bring the person back to their normal (pre-schizoid) state." sounds fine, but it isn't based on anything.

No evidence, no logic... just an uneducated hunch which you have.

The videos posted present nothing worthy of debate as far as i can see.

diggy
05-18-2009, 02:34 AM
Why are you so negative?

Are you depressed, Pat?

Do you have mental illness?

Koolish
05-19-2009, 01:28 PM
i remember watching this video about a russian (maybe latvian) exorcist, and he explicit stated you have to be sure that the issue isn't a mental illness.

however, the news report said a nurse from a mental institution watched him lay hands on a schizophrenic and cure it.