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oDoUoSoKo
08-26-2009, 06:21 PM
anybody like this guys work? ill admit to only having seen most of Coffee and Ciggs, and Ghost Dog..but i really like the stuff from Coffee and Ciggs...and im gonna check out Dead Man..what do u guys think?

The Hound
08-26-2009, 08:44 PM
Great movie accompanied by great music. More people need to check the film out

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DR. NICK RIVIERA
08-27-2009, 04:23 AM
he makes special movies, like Wes Anderson

...i'd say Coffee & Cigarretes is his best movie

oDoUoSoKo
08-27-2009, 09:05 AM
its funny that i havent seen more of his stuff considering hes friends with (and often works with) Iggy Pop, Tom Waits, and Neil Young...artists i love...im getting right on it...starting with Dead man.

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 09:30 AM
i like his work that i've seen (Dead man, stranger than paradise, mystery train, ghost dog, coffee and cigarettes)...even though his pacing is...idiosyncratic...it takes some getting used to imo. I need to see more of his work i think...i need to see broken flowers and doesn't he have a new movie coming out?

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 09:31 AM
http://wimg.co.uk/XgT.gif

what the hell is this from lol

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 09:34 AM
dead man has one of the most tense starts to a movie ever imo...it's almost ten minutes where you're wondering when the fuck anything is going to happen lol i tried watching it with some friends over but it revealed to me that they're idiots with no taste in films lol it's a good film though, his stuff is more contemplative and cerebral than a visceral entertainment experience imo.

KERZO
08-27-2009, 09:43 AM
yeah i liked ghost dog and ima def check out dead man now ive heard of it. it was cool when rza came to glasgow for a special showing of ghost dog before his gig (he took questions,done signings etc)...

any of you seen 'broken flowers' or 'the limits of control' cos i might dl them if ya'll think they're worth the watch?

Art Vandelay
08-27-2009, 09:48 AM
i own ghostdog, coffee and cigarettes, dead man and broken flowers. dead man is great. broken flowers was a great concept, but could have been better. best part about broken flowers is when that chick (eric's new girlfriend from entourage) gets naked.

jaupoon
08-27-2009, 10:45 AM
he makes special movies, like Wes Anderson

...i'd say Coffee & Cigarretes is his best movie

Have you seen the rest of Jim Jarmuschs films? I dont know how you could think Coffee and Cigs is his best film. The majority of people think its one of his worst. Personally i dont think its his worst, its probably my fifth favorite, but Dead Man and Down By Law are FAR FAR better films. And im a Wu Tang fanatic and LOVED seeing RZA and GZA in the film but if you havent seen his other films (all of his films from 1995 and before) you have to see them.

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 11:09 AM
so 'the limits of control' is already out?
is it on dvd yet?

broken flowers has bill murray so it's at the very least watchable lol

jaupoon
08-27-2009, 11:16 AM
The limits of control was released in theaters but its not on DVD yet. And as for Broken Flowers yeah its watchable but its nowehere near as good as Jarmuschs other flicks.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 11:20 AM
Coffee and Cigarettes is wildly overrated to me, but whatever.

Three or four good scenes.

Limits of Control got some pretty bad reviews, but it appeals to me.

Probably check it out once it arrives on DVD

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 11:23 AM
^^^i agree on coffee and cigarettes, but i'm not wild about vignette-based films anyway

what is limits of control about? cast? yes i know i'm online but i'm lazy and would rather get the insights of wucorpians

jaupoon
08-27-2009, 11:26 AM
Coffee and Cigarettes is wildly overrated to me, but whatever.

Three or four good scenes.

Limits of Control got some pretty bad reviews, but it appeals to me.

Probably check it out once it arrives on DVD

I agree with u 100% dude. Coffee and cigarettes is overrated. And yeah, it does have a couple cool scenes but half of the scenes suck. The RZA and GZA joint "delirium" is great though!

Jim Jarmusch is much better than Coffee and Cigarettes.

His good flicks:
Ghost Dog: Way Of The Samurai
Down By Law
Dead Man
Night On Earth


As far as Stranger Than Paradise goes, I like it but a lot of people have short attention spans and find it boring but in reality its one of the most important independent films of the 1980s. But i can see why some people find it boring. As far as the 4 flicks i listed above, theyre great.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 11:31 AM
Yeah, i've seen Ghost Dog and Dead Man, both are great.

The scene with Jack and Meg White in Coffee and Cigarettes is unfortunately one of the most excruciating film experiences i've had.

And i can pretty much watch anything and enjoy it.

oDoUoSoKo
08-27-2009, 11:39 AM
wow, really? whats makes it so, for you?

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 11:58 AM
Just how tedious it is.

The dialogue seemed so stilted, humourless and i hate to use the term, but boring.

I can remember sitting there and after about a minute just waiting for it to finish already.

Which never happens when i watch a flick.

The scene with Steve Coogan and Alfed Molina is great, as are a couple of others (Bill Murrary/GZA/RZA, Tom Waits/Iggy Pop etc.)

As a film though, it's just without many redeeming features to me.

I can endure the most pointless and self indulgent cinema as long as there is enough apart from that which interests me.

Coffee and Cigarettes is regrettably pretty forgettable in my opinion though.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 12:03 PM
^^^i agree on coffee and cigarettes, but i'm not wild about vignette-based films anyway

what is limits of control about? cast? yes i know i'm online but i'm lazy and would rather get the insights of wucorpians

What's it about?

I think a lot of reviewers had a problem with that question also.

It's about a guy, who is doing something, and who travels around, and keeps meeting with different people who give him information in code form.

Since i haven't seen it, that's about as good as i can do lol.

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 12:13 PM
^^^sounds interesting enough to me...i guess i'll just wiki or imdb it to find out the cast lol

the coogan/molina scene was the best one in coffee and cigarettes imo followed by rza/gza/bill murray...your choices reflect my taste as well lol but the film overall seemed pretenious, verging on self indulgent, almost like an inconsequential excuse for him to get together a bunch of friends, colleagues, and people he was a fan of masqurading as a film.

i think jarmusch had the potential to be on the level of the coen brothers for example, but he seems to absolutely refuse to be straightforward and visceral, not necessarily even to eschew these traits in the event that they would be detrimental to his art...i almost get the impression that he's willfully obscure and detached from his subject matter...but that's probably the jean luc godard influence...jarmusch is almost like an old school french 'nouvelle vague' director who just happens to be american lol

sorry for the ramble, i just find myself conflicted in assessing his work.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 12:23 PM
Hm, yeah, that line is between skillfulness and pretentiousness is always a pretty thin one.

To be honest, a lot of the minimalistic european films i've seen, have been more pretentious than most art house american films i've looked at.

You look at someone like David Lynch (not that their styles are at all similar) just for the sake of comparison, and although the 'meaning' (another term i am hesitant to use) isn't always clear or present at all, but everything else is brilliant.

Eraserhead is a good example. One of the most bizarre films i've seen, but at no point does it seem (to me at least) an exercise in purposeful eccentricity. A comes across that Lynch wouldn't consider it 'weird' or anything like that. That's just how it is, but i don't think it is a conscious decision on his part.

A meaning to me is pretty much insignificant to how enjoyable a movie isa, but when you get a collection of visually dull images in combination with minimal dialogue and an inconclusive plot, it's rare to produce a great film.

Alienation for alienation's sake is irritating for a viewer.

I don't mind feeling uncomfortable, but feeling as though a director is being deliberately obtuse for no reason apart from fulfilling his own ego, annoys me.

Not that i feel this way the whole way through Jarmusch films, but at times, it crops up.

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 12:46 PM
^^^exactly...well said
that's why i said i got the impression that he was occasionally being 'willfuly' obcure.

it's probably one of the greatest challenges is filmmaking to be artful (as far as shot composition, cinematgraphy, and manipulating your performers), and obscure or ambiguous while still providing visceral entertainment that is both emotionally and intellectually engaging. some films seem to treat emotional engagement as banal and an unworthy goal lol

like you said, with lynch you get the impression that this is just his perception of the world, or at least the events he is depicting, just as with kubrick you get the sense that clinical detachment or objectivity is part of his world view. sometimes with jarmusch, specifically in dead man and stranger than paradise, i got the sense that he was pushing things in the direction of weirdness or awkardness where it didn't necessarily enhance or improve anything.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 12:52 PM
Yeah, i mean, i still like the films of his i've seen (bar Coffee & Cigarettes), but it's kind of in the back of my mind.

It's all perspective though, i know a few friends that feel that Lynch is pretentious and purposely confusing, a point which i've tried and failed to argue about with them.

Which reminds me, i'm still waiting to get my copy of Blue Velvet off a dude who's had it for about 6 months.

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 01:00 PM
^^^is it the criterion?
i fail to see where any of lynch's films are pretentious...they do know what pretensious means, right? lol...because some people use the word as shorthand for 'i didn't get it'
eraserhead is the only one of his films that even flirts with pretension imo, and i attribute that to it being his first feature length film and to the feel created in part by the cinematography and sets and lighting...but lynch is lynch. A is A. Jarmusch is occasionally Jamrusch plus affectations and aspirations derived from being a fan of European art films and burgeoning 'auterism'.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 01:06 PM
Mulholland Drive was the film in question.

It was a pretty narrow discussion, basically involving an off handed, close ended comment something like "lynch is a dick, who tries to make things complicated/misleading/convoluted to disguise the fact that his films are about nothing".

And infuriating comment.

I hate when people say "nothing happened/there was no meaning" about a film.

A dude i know said that about Reservoir Dogs.

I think a lot of people feel cheated or annoyed if, when they reach the end of a film, no obvious moral is presented.

Ridiculous.

Dr. Simon Hurt
08-27-2009, 01:32 PM
oh ok mulholland drive...sure,i suppose that would be the most likely to get that label...lynch creates an atmosphere with his films that's more important to me than whether or not the narrative is straightforward lol
morality is subjective and life isn't shaped like a story; you're going to get a more evocative and personal experience watching a film that doesn't give you 'answers' and just shows you events and imagery without telling you how to judge it.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 01:38 PM
Exactly, MD is all about the atmosphere.

Anyway, this thread is getting pretty far off Jarmusch films, i'll see Limits of Control and report back.

oDoUoSoKo
08-27-2009, 02:46 PM
sorry to jump back into Lynch tho...i usually tell people who feel the way ur friends do...to watch Blue Velvet if they havent..it is so heavy with symbolism and atmoshperic emotion.

Longbongcilvaringz
08-27-2009, 02:49 PM
Yeah, Blue Velvet is a good combination of all of Lynch's techniques.

I don't know anyone who's seen it, who didn't think it was great.

DR. NICK RIVIERA
08-27-2009, 03:53 PM
I guess Wera is a weirdo. I haven't seen any of his new movies tho, I admit.