View Full Version : DNA proof that Jews are not Semites.

03-03-2010, 08:29 AM

Who is a Jew? As the recent passport row shows, that question can be murky, with elements of belief, values, descent and nationality mixed in.

It also has dark reminders of a terrible time in history when Jewish blood meant death; and science, or pseudo-science, claimed to be able to sniff it out.

Things have changed. A decade ago, I was passing through Ben Gurion airport in Tel Aviv carrying a box filled with small tubes. Alerted by the Syrian stamp in my passport, the security staff gave me a hard time. After emptying my case, she asked what was in the box. I replied, irritably: "Arab spit". "What?" she said. "I'm a geneticist, I explained, I have been sampling Palestinian DNA. At once, her face brightened ah, DNA. Had I heard the then novel stuff on the shared male chromosomes of priestly Jewish families such as the Cohens? I had, and we parted on amicable terms.

The conversation gave me pause for thought. Joseph Mengele himself wrote his doctoral thesis on the relationship between jaw shape and racial identity. His ideas were pernicious rubbish and even 20 years later the thought of a genetic test for Jewish descent would have been treated with horror. Now, one has emerged and is not despised but hailed by many Jews themselves.

A scan of half a million variable sites across the genomes of several hundred Europeans and Americans, each aware from their family history of having had a recent Jewish or a non-Jewish ancestry, gave an absolute separation between Jews and others: even a single Jewish grandparent was enough to provide an unambiguous identity, written in DNA. A carefully chosen sample of just 300 of those sites does almost as well, and a test based on that would be cheap.

Judaism is inherited down the female line as are mitochondria. Their DNA shows that today's Jews from the largest group, the eight million Ashkenazim most of whom once found their home in central and eastern Europe, and who now represent the majority of American Jews have few grandmothers. Around half descend from just four women who bear mitochondrial types found almost exclusively in that population. Two million trace their descent from just one of those ancient predecessors.

In 1650, there were only 100,000 Ashkenazim in Europe, a number then further reduced by pogroms. In 18th-century central Europe, though, came massive expansion of that population, largely because of their relatively good living conditions. In Frankfurt, Jewish life expectancy was at aged 48, compared to 37 among non-Jews. By 1800, Jews numbered two million and by 1900 almost four times as many.

Much of the growth occurred in the Rhine Valley modern-day Germany. The increase was concentrated among a few well-off families, many of whom had 10 children while the poorest classes had far fewer. As a result, the majority of today's Ashkenazim derive from a small proportion of that population, two million from one mother, quite literally their shared Eve, who probably lived unknown and unrecognised in an affluent household in a German or Polish village three centuries ago. A shared close identity through mothers, grandmothers, and more is, for millions of Ashkenazim, a genetical fact.

For others, though, the story is murkier. A separate great centre of Jewish tradition and culture grew up in Spain. Most of the Sephardim arrived after the peninsula fell under Roman control in the second century BC. In 711 AD, a Muslim army invaded. The Jews flourished under a tolerant regime, often as lawyers, merchants and the like. Then the Church returned. After a century of persecution, they were expelled in 1492. The Sephardim were scattered over much of Europe, the Middle East, and the New World.

Their mitochondria, unlike those of the Ashkenazim, give no sign of a recent bottleneck. Their DNA show instead how porous the boundaries of faith may be. Threatened by the Inquisition, thousands of Spanish Jews left to places such as Turkey. Others converted, or pretended to do so and one Portuguese village maintained a secret Jewish culture, marrying among themselves for five centuries.

Y chromosomes reveal much leakage across the religious divide. A fifth of all the male lineages of modern Spain are of Jewish origin, which means that millions of devout Spanish Catholics have Sephardic ancestry, while the Sephardim themselves, with their unique and ancient Jewish ritual, present a wider range of genetic variation than do their Ashkenazi cousins. Plenty of those with one faith have biological roots in the other. My wife, as it happens, comes from a Sephardic family and has relatives with surnames such as Cardozo and Pexiota. After 40 years here, she has still not got round to obtaining a British passport. In spite of the double helix, identity remains a confusing thing.

> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/7346496/View-from-the-Lab-Who-is-a-Jew-DNA-can-hold-the-key.html

Ghost In The 'Lac
03-03-2010, 08:40 AM
Yeah but at the end of the day this means nothing because Jew's take their identity from myths and superstition from 2000 year old books.

Religion is the problem, not genes.

Uncle Steezo
03-03-2010, 06:20 PM
it proves that their blood claim on israel is false.

Ghost In The 'Lac
03-03-2010, 10:05 PM
It doesnt prove shit they are there because a fucking 2000 year old work of fiction TELLS them that its their land not because its where they think their great great granny is from

this is just more bullshit skirting skirting the real cause of the drama - fucking RELIGION

theyre allowed to do all this dumb shit in the name of a fairy tale

03-03-2010, 10:09 PM
This is ridiculous. You can't be a "Jew" ethnically. Its a religion/culture. That's like saying you can see the differences between a Shinto and Buddhist person in Japan. Shinto is a religion with a culture associated with it as is Buddhism. But they're ideas, not ethnic identities.

I can get married to a Black or Asian women and then we can convert to Judaism. I just follow their practices and I'm a Jew. We're both Jews, and we're married inside the faith, but that doesn't make me any more Semitic. I'm still Russian and Irish and she'd still be a Laotian whore. The point is it makes no sense to think that way. There was a time where it was almost totally true, then a time when it was partially true, but it isn't now.

Ghost In The 'Lac
03-03-2010, 10:22 PM
You dont understand the Jewish faif son. The whole teaching of it is about "Exclusivity", not anyone can be a Jew. Thats their whole shit. Its a major theme in the Torah, about their exclusivity to the religion.

Its not like christianity, which is all about spreading the word, you wont ever find a Jew trying to convert people.

YES you can marry a Jew and convert of course its not against rules to convert to Judaism or anything it is actually very much preferred but you wont be considered a real Jew.

03-03-2010, 10:40 PM
Bah. I don't buy it.

What's next "DNA proves Jesus was in fact a Jew. Romans apologize for scapegoating his own people for his death. DNA also proves he was not God just ridiculously good at telling jokes."


Mic Tyson
03-03-2010, 11:02 PM
watch out for them khazars

03-04-2010, 06:17 AM
we are all genetically pretty much the same, so who gives a shit if jews are semite or not.

even jews don't give a shit about that lol.

03-04-2010, 09:56 AM
A Semite is a descendant of the biblical figure 'Shem'.
Noah had 3 sons:
Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Under the lineage of Shem, we have 'Heber', who is Shem's great grandson.
Heber's descendants are called 'Hebrew'.
The Hebrew people are therefore Semites.
Descendants of Heber include Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael.
Abraham is therefore a Hebrew Semite,
Ishamel, eldest son of Abraham, had a different mother than his younger brother Isaac.
Ishmael's mother's name was Hagar, an Egyptian Pharoah's daughter who was gifted to Abraham as a maid but became his concubine or wife after Sarah (isaac's mother) could not conceive children.
Egyptians are descendants of Kush, who is a descendant of Ham.
Ishmael is said to be the father of Arabs.
Ever wondered why Arabic and Hebrew alphabet look so similar?
Arabic is just Hebrew mixed with Egyptian, as Ishmael is a Hebrew-Egyptian mixed child.

Sarah was a full Hebrew like Abraham and they had Isaac as a miracle later on.
From Isaac we have Jacob.
Jacob became Israel.
Jacob-Israel's descendants are known as Israelites.
He had 12 sons.
One of his sons was Judah.
Judah's descendants are called Judahites.
Ok so so far we have Judahites = Semitic Hebrew Israelites from the Tribe of Judah.
Jesus was a descendant of Judah.
Therefore he is a Judahite (or Semitic Hebrew Israelite from the tribe of Judah)

Moses was from Jacob's son, Levi, making him a Levite (or Semitic Hebrew Israelite from the tribe of Levi)

let's get back to Noah's son Japheth.
Japheth had a son named Gomez.
And Gomez had a son names
and his descendants are known as
and as you can see,
"Jewish" people are Ashkenazi, not SEMITIC. They are JAPHETIC through Gomez.

The TORAH never has the word 'JEW' in it,
it refers to the people in the Scripture as
HEBREW people.

When Moses leads his people out, the Scripture always talks about Free the Hebrew people, save the hbrew people, etc

never is the word JEW mentioned.

The Jews stole the Hebrew culture, that is the truth.
Japhet is the ancestor of wicked shit, real talk... I mean...

GOG & MAGOG ring a bell?

Well guess what one of Japhet's sons name is...

03-04-2010, 10:44 AM
1 big happy family huh