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View Full Version : should hollywood stop with the comic book movies already?


Dr. Simon Hurt
07-19-2010, 09:41 PM
seriously, most of them are trash...too many concessions are made to 'realism' (only in a design sense, story logic, characterization and dialogue do not have to be realistic by any means) and so much of what makes these characters interesting is usually lost in translation.

for every 'dark knight' or 'iron man', there's a 'ghost rider', spider-man 3, fantastic 4, punisher war zone, wolverine origins, superman returns, or elektra that'll make you want to gouge your eyes out.

you end up with captain america being a 'uso performer' who's embarassed of his costume. wtf?

plus, as a comic fan, most of them make me cringe and i hate people asking me about them lol

if you're going to adapt a comic like spider-man or superman cinematically, why not do it in animation?

Dr. Simon Hurt
07-19-2010, 09:47 PM
i also find it annoying that the non superhero comic adaptations, that tend to be better/more faithful to their source material, have their comic connections frequently downplayed (ghost world, history of violence, road to perdition)

oDoUoSoKo
07-19-2010, 10:07 PM
ive never EVER approved of comic book adaptations..even tho there are plenty of good ones. they should stop asap

Dr. Simon Hurt
07-19-2010, 10:16 PM
^why have you never approved?

oDoUoSoKo
07-19-2010, 10:21 PM
i feel like, with non graphic text, it works better because it can add a visual interpretation of the book, with comics..u have that already..atleast to the point where i dont really want a film for it

Dr. Simon Hurt
07-19-2010, 10:26 PM
^i agree, i just tend to dislike the lack of fidelity to the source material, to the extent that the film-makers seemed embarassed by the trappings of the material they are adapting.

however, if david lynch wanted to direct his own vision of 'batman' that had fuck-all to do with the comics, i'd probably be all over it, as unnecessary and pointless as it would be.

oDoUoSoKo
07-19-2010, 10:32 PM
exactly and u see thats where it kills me also, the intententions behind the project

TAURO
07-19-2010, 10:35 PM
seriously, most of them are trash...too many concessions are made to 'realism' (only in a design sense, story logic, characterization and dialogue do not have to be realistic by any means) and so much of what makes these characters interesting is usually lost in translation.

This would take too long to explain but in a nutshell I think comic fans need to realise that these movies are adaptions and NOT direct translations of the source material. How faithful really depends on the director and his creative team. Sometimes characters prove challenging even for the most talented of directors to fully realise, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't try.

Also it should be noted that at times the movie adaptions have improved on aspects from their comic counterparts.

for every 'dark knight' or 'iron man', there's a 'ghost rider', spider-man 3, fantastic 4, punisher war zone, wolverine origins, superman returns, or elektra that'll make you want to gouge your eyes out.

With everything including comics themselves there is always trial and error. To be fair hollywood has been getting better at these movies as time has gone on, you may not agree but the longer these characters remain in the public eye, these film makers slowly but surely start to "get it".

you end up with captain america being a 'uso performer' who's embarassed of his costume. wtf?

You can't comment on this film yet since you haven't even seen a trailer yet. At least wait until you at least see leaked comic con footage before you start to bitch.

plus, as a comic fan, most of them make me cringe and i hate people asking me about them lol

If the movie makes you cringe then thats just because these comic characters are corny by their very nature, it's just not so apparent on the printed page.

And whats wrong in being asked about them, my friends ask me all the time, then info I give them only helps them to get excited even more for the characters.

if you're going to adapt a comic like spider-man or superman cinematically, why not do it in animation?

Why not both?

Im afraid I have to respectfully disagree. Im loving the comicbook movie boom and I hope it goes on for at least another ten years.

i also find it annoying that the non superhero comic adaptations, that tend to be better/more faithful to their source material, have their comic connections frequently downplayed (ghost world, history of violence, road to perdition)

Why would this bother you so much?, what matters is that you know. You can tell your friends about their comic origins and let them seek it out if they want.

Dr. Simon Hurt
07-19-2010, 10:41 PM
^^it bothers me because it tacitly perpetuates the idea that 'comic book= superhero', which is something that we need to move away from.

and the whole thing about adapting it and not making it a direct translation, if you are going to make drastic changes to the material, like changing the setting and backstory of 'v for vendetta' and making it a toothless anti-bush polemic...why adapt it in the first place? why not make an original story that hits those notes?

about the cap thing...i'm bitching about a story detail that the director discussed in an interview that already shows they don't really get the material or have faith in it. if a director said 'we're going to make alfred bruce wayne's biological father', i don't need to see the flick to feel this is ill-conceived. but i get your point.

i also agree that some adaptations have made improvements to the material, but this is a rarity (making 'blade' cool, making xavier's academy an actual school)

TAURO
07-19-2010, 11:00 PM
I haven't read V for vendetta but I thought the film was decent. I can't make the comparison but as someone that went in blind, I found it to be a very interesting and engaging story.

As for Captain America...you do realise that it's Marvel thats funding this flick, not some studio that just has the rights. Who would know better about the material than the people that created it in the first place.

Joe Johnston is a risky choice as director for this film but based on what he did on Rocketeer I have faith he will get a good handle on the tone of the movie.

Paranoid
07-19-2010, 11:25 PM
yes, they should. I'd rather read the comics then watch some mediocrity

Edit: but keep the batman coming

main_man
07-20-2010, 02:29 AM
i dont think they should flat out stop, but i think they should slow down a lot.

the only real plus i've seen in the last couple years regarding these flims is the fact marvel has its own studio now. and those movies do have more respect for the source material itself.
if you keep letting douce bag, ari gold type studio execs run these films we'll see many more wolverines then iron mans.
i think the real problem is the mentality of the people they give these projects to. they think, "comic book = corny" and run with that thought process. punisher is a perfect example of this. 3 times they make films about the EASIEST comic character to make a bad ass movie about and EVERY fucking time they have to make it corny as fuck.
and yes, these characters are infused with some corniness, no doubt. but you can bypass that and just make a GOOD FILM with a GOOD STORY (nolan, im looking at you. lol).
they seem afraid to put mature themes in these movies, and the audience suffers for it (people who made wolverine, im looking at you). if they gave these properties to people who gave a shit, then we wouldnt see so many mediocre and bad adaptations.

and i agree. animation is the perfect format to make these characters come to life. cause even with all these flicks, you'll be hard pressed to find any of them as good as the justice league series. MORE ANIMATION!

Paranoid
07-20-2010, 02:44 AM
i would much rather see these characters animated. as long as it isn't lame...

David Daniel Davis
07-20-2010, 11:17 AM
I think that Thor will be one of the best yet.

TSA
07-20-2010, 01:20 PM
not if they're gonna keep him in that corny ass suit that leaked

angry!
07-20-2010, 02:36 PM
nah...

they should stop making bad comic book movies... and either give the movie rights to people that love the source material, or creative people inspired by the source material!!!!!!!!

its a fuckin shame...

they yet to make a authentic X-MEN flick, they made a gay rights action fantasy out of the franchise... brian singer is a faggot, that should direct faggot films... get someone that loves the comics, and youll get a good movie... SIMPLE!!!!!!!!!

they yet to make a dope SUPERMAN movie with crazy effects/huge set pieces.... again... they give it to brian singer, who makes a 300 million dollar "i dream of supes in love/lets cast closet fag spacey as lex and fag out on WB dime"!!!!!!!!!!!

2 wack punisher movies, a proper punisher movie, will click with audiences, and be a fan favorite franchise, source material ... is already THERE!!!!!!!

green lantern movie, gonna be epic disaster, van wilder ruins every movie hes, by being, van wilder!!!!!!!!!!!!! get a black actor (michael jai white) and make green lantern... HUGE!!!!!!!!

yet to make a proper HULK movie... bana sucked, nolte was on SMACK... ed norton was weak, effects were trash, set pieces were garbage, colors were muted.. make it bright, vibrant, outlandish, like the comics!!!!!!!!!!

and i still wanna see...

BATMAN: THE DARK KNIGHT by frank miller... made into a film... with an old, battered, over the hill, alcoholic bruce wayne, pullin out the cape... i had a dream SLY was in where he was an old bruce wayne... shit was GULLY!!!!!!!!

it can co-exist alongside NOLANS vision...

just like theres a 100 different batman stories on the shelf of bookstores... they can co-exist!!!!!!!

why cant there be 2 different spiderman films being made at once!?!?!?!? cuz studios livin in the past!!!!!!!!!!!!!

you know... they made a wolverine origins flick, that barely covered his origins!!!!!!!!

the idea was there, just give it to somebody that actually cares about wolverine... not some faggot prick lookin to impress the studio with his hollow reinvisioning!!!!!!!!

burton didnt know shit about batman, and the OG batman is classic...

why!??!?!?!!? his take was daring, visually pleasing, different, and DOPE!!!!!!!

i like pandemics idea about lynch directing a comic book movie...

give lynch a big budget comic book movie... and even if it has little to do with the source material, itll win, cuz audiences are smarter than the box office thinks!!!!!!!!!!!

KZA
07-20-2010, 07:35 PM
hollywood runs out of ideas when it comes to making movies so taking ideas from a comic book would turn it into profit.

im tired of the reboots of spider-man, batman, x-men, superman. is it really necessary to watch the origins over and over. they could have it summarized in a flashback in less than 90 seconds or just buy the damn dvd of the previous stories to get an understanding of what is going on.

also canceling cartoons and rebooting them also. spectacular spider-man and wolverine and the x-men were damn good cartoons too.

Bobby_Digital72
07-20-2010, 10:42 PM
A bit off topic but i think the same arguement can made about video game adaptions...

oDoUoSoKo
07-20-2010, 11:02 PM
there were 3 punisher movies btw

TheBoarzHeadBoy
07-21-2010, 02:28 AM
One of my biggest problems is they set them in the wrong time. Captain American was a world war 2 super soldier. I don't want him updated and turned into a PTSD political statement or something. I want to see a one man army fucking shit up from D Day to Berlin where he personally rips Hitler a new asshole with the irreverence of Inglorious Bastards. You know, a proper ultra patriotic Nazi slam fest. Then in the last scene tosses his VE Day newspaper in the fire of a burning panzer tank and says something like "I'm thinking this Stalin bastard needs a fucking good lickin'." He should be like a young George Patton with super powers.

Ironman was fucking shit up in Vietnam. I want a patriotic view of Vietnam. These are superheroes, they represent the American spirit, my opinion is you don't shit on America, ever. And I want at least a Ghostface Killah cameo (cough War Machine cough). He deserves it... Tony Starks my nigga!

Batman should be set in either the 1920s or the 1960s in Chicago. You know, fisticuffs with the mob and shit. Beating down thugs with their own tommy guns and shit. Telling that "Untouchable" Elliot Ness to shove it up his ass. That's cinema.

I mean they don't try to do Sherlock Holmes in 2010. The only attempt at that was House MD which would suck miserably if Hugh Lauries wasn't a genius actor. As is its still stupid at times because you realize that every episode is solved and everyone expects him to kill the guy instead of saving him every fucking episode... but that's not really because of the setting.

You know what I'd like to see? A better version of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. For arguably the best idea ever in modern fiction, they made a second rate movie. I mean I love Connery so he can do no wrong, but that movie could have been a lot better. I'm a bit of a Victorian science fiction lover myself, so here's what I want to see for a "comic book movie":

The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen: War of The Worlds

Worthy of being written by Alan Moore. You know, Volume II. Since the original movie was loosely based on the first volume and there are 4 volumes (including black dossier) they can make an unrelated sequel without trampling on the first one or acknowledging its lackluster quality. Oh and make it R. I want to see hyde (who looks like a steroided out Nosferatu) rip someone in half/eat them... a little? I mean watchmen wasn't terrible, they can make decent movies with comic book heroes. I'm not sure it should be a Zack Snyder movie, but he's probably one of the only directors who has made comic book movie work almost to its fullest.

IMO, if it's Alan Moore, make it smart. If its DC make it over the top violent. If its Marvel make it feel good but not in a goody goody way.

tostones
07-21-2010, 11:52 PM
One of the problems is that comicbooks (graphics and the written word combined) is a strong medium in its own right, and allows for things that just aren't possible in a film (or at the very least very hard to pull off).

For example, a lot of comix will have a running naration which is hard to do on film. Also, comix can show you the thoughts of characters in writing, which is hard to pull off in film. There are many more examples.

A lot of the stuff that "happens" in comics, happens in our heads. To use Scott McCloud's example, when someone raises an axe in one frame, and then there's a head in the basket in the next frame, our mind creates the killing in that little blank column in between. This is happening time and time again throughout the entire comic. Tapping into that is virtually impossible in film.

Its like, yo every supes story you ever read happened partly in your head. Can a hollywood film ever really match that?

peace