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Old 02-15-2010, 09:30 AM   #1
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Default iSOCIALISMO O MUERTE!



Remembering Che Guevara..
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Old 02-15-2010, 02:37 PM   #2
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Killed so many innocent people... As in personally shot them for fun.

Not even funny.

Che was a psychopath who hid under the banner of communism and helped overthrew a country for his own benefits.

There are no good communist revolutionaries. Except dead revolutionaries.

Not to offender your political beliefs...

National Socialism sounds really good on paper too, then you implement it and suddenly a shit ton of minorities are getting cremated...
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Old 02-15-2010, 02:40 PM   #3
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I heard he gave incredible mustache rides
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Old 02-15-2010, 05:21 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by TheBoarzHeadBoy View Post
Killed so many innocent people... As in personally shot them for fun.

Not even funny.

Che was a psychopath who hid under the banner of communism and helped overthrew a country for his own benefits.

There are no good communist revolutionaries. Except dead revolutionaries.

Not to offender your political beliefs...

National Socialism sounds really good on paper too, then you implement it and suddenly a shit ton of minorities are getting cremated...
First of all, you shouldn`t speak on the subject because you don`t even know the difference between Hitlers ``National Socialism`` and Socialism - two completely ideological opposites:

One advocates the overthrow of patriarchy, the bourgeoisie and private property (so that all property, particularly factories and the means of production become publically owned). The other aims to perpetuate these reactionary conditions and is not at all a friend of the poor and working class.

However, back to Che:

Che had, with the help of former anti-communist Castro, taken a country from a pocket American dictator Batista where the following conditions existed:

* Americans owned 70 % of the arable land.
* 1% of the population controlled 46 % of the wealth.
* Batista's goons and secret police killed 20,000 Cubans (tortured even more).
* 67 % of the population were illiterate.
* 50 % of the population lived in Bohio shacks.
* Dissidents were hung and left to dangle in the streets as a warning sign.
* The Mafia (Meyer Lansky & Co) ran Havana and used Cuba as a whorehouse for rich gringos from the U.S.

Turned it around, virtually eliminated illiteracy, established the highest quality of life per capita in all of south america, the most respected healthcare system in all of latin america as well as instating free post-secondary education.

A tiny island, and I mean this with no offense, but a pimple on the face of the earth that is far from self-sufficient is able to gain for their citizens more than we can here by munching on the scraps our national bourgeois feed us.

In the beginning of it all, Castro himself was anti-communist, mainly because at the time, when Stalin was in power of the USSR, Josef had [with his ridiculous "Socialism in one country" ideology] told all international socialists to align themselves with their 'capitalist compatriots' - meaning Cuban socialists at the time supported U.S-puppet dictator Batista. It was an interesting dynamic for cuba which, especially after the seizure of all inter/national assets within Cuba were completed, required socialism as to never subordinate the Cuban people to a Western capitalist system again as it would only replace one form of overt tyranny for another.

Capitalism is not freedom, for some odd reason you have a mutual exclusivity of the two. Especially at this point in development of capitalism, any 'aspiring' capitalist nation is immediately dependant on and forever indebted to the western capitalist simply because of how disproportionate the market and its leaders are.

Among that, there are far more inherent fallacies of capitalism and it's hinderence in the development of society and community in particular. In a (capitalist) society where you're in competition with and where you're indoctrinated to believing that happiness comes in the form of economic supercession of your coworkers, neighbours and community members, it can only result in mutual alienation between oneself and these people.

Furthermore, in this context, private property for some means no property for others. Commodification of healthcare and education also happens because its in the interests of the bourgeois which own these means of production because they can draw a profit. Let us also not forget that poverty, war and a tendency to monopoly are things completely inseperable to capitalism.

These are all things that make capitalism legal economic enslavement of a mass class(es) of people albeit qualitatively different from feudalism, still containing the same parallels therein. The power structure is just as interested in perpetuating slavery as it was hundreds of years ago.

Only with Marxist socialism (one which Cuba is not a shining example of, but a workers state nonetheless) is a new type of environment possible where sense of community and mutual co-dependence shine through and the state - an oppressive institution - is to be dedicated to its own dissolution.
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Old 02-15-2010, 07:59 PM   #5
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They are different, they're not opposites. The only difference is that National Socialism is what it says it is, and working Communism is a fools dream. In practice they're virtually identical. Powerful state running people's lives whether they like it or not bombarding them with fake nationalism propaganda just to keep them motivated.

The Nazis did what they said, the Communists said one thing and then largely did what the Nazis were doing, albeit they hid it well enough behind "Socialism for the People" that the common man thought they were different. Hitler and Stalin are practically the same, only Hitler was crazy (enough to almost gain my sympathy) and Stalin was inhumanly cold (enough to almost win my admiration). Which is worse. I can't tell you.

All those things were bad. However a bloodless coup and a free state would solve those things. Hell a blood drenched coup and a free state would solve those things. But communism didn't solve shit. All the stuff the communists managed to do was because of soviet aid. Russia saved Cuba, not communism.

Pure capitalism is a state of virtual anarchy Armand, and anarchy is ultimate freedom. Any limitations on Capitalism are put there for either the benefit of tyrants or for socialistic reasons. So you can say that American Capitalism isn't freedom, and I agree, but its freer the communism inherently.

America's a shit hole, but that's because Progressives beat our country to death over the years. Current America is not the America our founders created. Not even close. Sure I'm a reactionary in the minds of some people, but in other ways my viewpoints are revolutionary. Big government is the same kind of tyranny that my country fought the British over. I'm no tea bagger and I can't stand Miss Folksy Palin, but I have my ideas and my values and I'm right.

America fucked over Cuba. Cuba needed fixing. They just got the wrong person to fix it. Castro I don't mind that much for some reason, but Che was a fuck and I don't like his t shirts. I'd wear a Castro shirt for the same reasons I'd wear a Stalin shirt ("Broseph Stalin" or "Fidel Casbro" and a face sillouette with a cigar for casbro of course are just provocative and funny, but a Che shirt is played out and not edgy so I don't get it.)
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Old 02-16-2010, 02:35 PM   #6
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The proletariat must negate the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie and establish a state by and for themselves for the dignity of all working people. A radical worker democracy; a dictatorship of the proletariat.

You however are dreaming. You let your comfortable priveleged upbringing get to your head.

I don't have time for dreams.

All power to the people.
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Old 02-19-2010, 07:50 PM   #7
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I don't know why we can't have rich and poor people. Wealth is not measured in currency but in quality of life. Meritocratic society is far superior to a socialistic society. There's no such thing as a free meal. There's nothing wrong with working hard and making money. There's also nothing wrong with working hard and making a lot of money. Money doesn't buy happiness. Happiness is more important.

You realize socialism has no motivating factor. Most people don't care about other people's well being to the point they'll work for it with no benefits to them self. Communist ideology is the people's Heroin. It'll get you off the opium of religion, that's for sure. But its much worse for you.

Instead you should take the aspirin of Capitalism and Bayer* it like a man.

(Get it... because it's capitalism so I'm selling a product...)
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Old 02-20-2010, 10:59 AM   #8
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Meritocracy is flawed today in that it doesn't take into account extraneous factors such as one's wealth or poverty as being determining factors in one's 'merit.'

For example, where we live in a class-stratified society where the forces of production are not owned by the people, where the capitalist state contains within itself insoluble contradictions that it can not exist without (poverty, war, class struggle), then there is no way in measuring ones merit, for his or her merit could stem merely from having a wealthy father as opposed to no father and having been born in a broken home.

Merit can be properly measured only through the abolition of these economic conditions. This would require the overthrow of the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie that is capitalism, and placing a workers' state where human beings can live in solidarity with one another.

Marx did not believe in welfare for the socialist state, so one could not expect to receive if he or she does not contribute. In this post-capitalist transitional state dedicated to the negation of itself and the transcendence of classes can we truly measure 'merit' via Marx' "from each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs."
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Old 02-20-2010, 01:58 PM   #9
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I don't know, communism won't sit well with me. I'm all for a society with an even playing field, but to do that we'd need more then communism, we'd need utilitarianism. That I can stomach better. I mean for communism to ever flourish you'd need a brave new world type of society. You'd need state run everything, the dissolving of families and the sole goal of enhancing the state. I don't think that's likely to work.
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Old 02-20-2010, 02:38 PM   #10
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