Church Vs. God.

[D.projectile]

http://www.spiritofthescripture.com/...kundalini.html

[rakimkoolgrapwutang]

Originally Posted by THE W

i'll respond to the first point on jesus' death for the forgiveness of sin

he doesnt have to repeat something 50 times for it be truth. when he says that his blood is the new covenant poured out for you it cant mean anything else but crucifixion added on top that him saying my body given for you.

you should check out the link i provided for FMJ on the 3 days 3nights thing. it explains this a whole lot better than i do.

jesus dying on the cross for our sins has been fortold since the old testament books.

thinking this shouldnt have happened because its cruel or unnecessary is to oppose the sovereignty of God the father.


as far as your other points and on the point above as well, they're all base on your personal world view. you can have that view if you wish and trying to change it was never in any way my intention.

i dont try to inject my world view into the scriptures. i only do exgesis as this is the only way scripture is to be understood. none of the views you present are in conjunction with sound exegesis of scriptural testimony and i dont think care for them to be as you seek to put God and his word under your judgement.

with that understanding there's isnt really anything left for us to discuss. CHRISTianity isnt for you.

u keep on making these massive assumptions. yes him dying on a cross is connected to a new covenant. but ur immediately jumping to the conclusion that hes doing it to get rid of our sin.

but it has been shown before that jesus could just forgive sins with a few words with gods permission. so a sacrafice is completely unnecessary. and a perfect god cant change his mind and say that at one moment a few words are necessary for sins to be forgiven and then the next minute a whole big sacrifice is needed. a perfect god cant change from one state to another because one of the states will be less perfect/good than the other which would imply god is going from a more perfect state to less perfect state or vice versa.

god never foretold that our sins would be forgiven with a sacrifice. he says our sins will be completely forgiven or else he compares jesus' death to a sacrifice but he never says our sins are forgiven because jesus died.

this is an errorenous judgement. the shift from christianity as an experience of the kingdom of heaven to a faith (i dont think kingdom of heaven is even mentioned in the bible after the gospels) as taught by paul also isnt good.

u say u live by the scripture but what if the disciples made mistakes (which they have)

christianity died when jesus died.

[THE W]

Originally Posted by D.projectile

http://www.spiritofthescripture.com/...kundalini.html

the bible doesnt testify to the events of the bible being metaphorical or symbolic. they testify to them being a part of world history.

to think otherwise is to apply your own world view to the scriptures.

[THE W]

Originally Posted by rakimkoolgrapwutang

u keep on making these massive assumptions. yes him dying on a cross is connected to a new covenant. but ur immediately jumping to the conclusion that hes doing it to get rid of our sin.

but it has been shown before that jesus could just forgive sins with a few words with gods permission. so a sacrafice is completely unnecessary. and a perfect god cant change his mind and say that at one moment a few words are necessary for sins to be forgiven and then the next minute a whole big sacrifice is needed. a perfect god cant change from one state to another because one of the states will be less perfect/good than the other which would imply god is going from a more perfect state to less perfect state or vice versa.

god never foretold that our sins would be forgiven with a sacrifice. he says our sins will be completely forgiven or else he compares jesus' death to a sacrifice but he never says our sins are forgiven because jesus died.

this is an errorenous judgement. the shift from christianity as an experience of the kingdom of heaven to a faith (i dont think kingdom of heaven is even mentioned in the bible after the gospels) as taught by paul also isnt good.

u say u live by the scripture but what if the disciples made mistakes (which they have)

christianity died when jesus died.

and you continue to apply your own world view to the scriptures. as i said, you can have the view if you wish. just know that it is in contradiction to biblical testimony.

you have made it clear you reject biblical testimony, there's nothing left for us to discuss.

[LORD NOSE]

smdh

[diggy]

Originally Posted by THE W

you think voltron is illogical?

Are you implying that your trinity-God concept is like voltron?

If you are, then be aware that if one of the pieces is destroyed or for some reason cannot come together with the others, then Voltron cannot be formed!!!

You have stated that: trinity = ``the one being God or Godhead comprised of 3 persons. the father, the son, the holy spirit.``

Jesus died, therefore your conception of God or as you call it the Godhead AKA the trinity cannot exist (assuming it existed in the first place).

By the way, when you compare your ``God`` to a cartoon robot, that does not make your ``God`` look real!!

[THE W]

Originally Posted by FMJ

Are you implying that your trinity-God concept is like voltron?

If you are, then be aware that if one of the pieces is destroyed or for some reason cannot come together with the others, then Voltron cannot be formed!!!

You have stated that: trinity = ``the one being God or Godhead comprised of 3 persons. the father, the son, the holy spirit.``

Jesus died, therefore your conception of God or as you call it the Godhead AKA the trinity cannot exist (assuming it existed in the first place).

By the way, when you compare your ``God`` to a cartoon robot, that does not make your ``God`` look real!!

it denounces your 1+1+1 cant equal one statement. voltron does just that. though voltron had more parts than 3 that came together to make one being which was voltron. do you think the concept of voltron is illogical?

jesus rose from the dead(he was not destroyed) and he returned to the father which was where he was at first.
john 16:28

so i guess your issue would be not believing someone can rise from death?

[Tectrus Moa]

Jesus isn't human, so the laws of death don't apply to him. He's perfect.

[diggy]

Originally Posted by THE W

it denounces your 1+1+1 cant equal one statement. voltron does just that. though voltron had more parts than 3 that came together to make one being which was voltron. do you think the concept of voltron is illogical?

jesus rose from the dead(he was not destroyed) and he returned to the father which was where he was at first.
john 16:28

so i guess your issue would be not believing someone can rise from death?

God does not need partners. If there is more than one God, then the lesser ones would fight for domination and there would be war in the heavens! Ultimately, there must be one God that made all this you see in the heavens and earth; logically, it had to start from one not three!

You are comparing God to Voltron, putting God in the wrong estimation! God has no comparison!

So you must believe that God died when Jesus died, which makes your concept of God perishable.

I believe it is possible to rise from death, so you are wrong on that.


Btw, the fact that you are comparing your conception of God to a cartoon character, should tell you something about the nature of your conception!!!

[LORD NOSE]

Originally Posted by Tectrus Moa

Jesus isn't human, so the laws of death don't apply to him. He's perfect.

Matthew 27:46
About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” (which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”).

Mark 15:34
And at three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachthani?” (which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”).


perfect aliens don't bleed and scream this on crosses


The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel. He will eat curds and honey when he knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right. But before the boy knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right, the land of the two kings you dread will be laid waste. The LORD will bring on you and on your people and on the house of your father a time unlike any since Ephraim broke away from Judah — he will bring the king of Assyria." (Isaiah 7:10-17)


virgin birth

[THE W]

Originally Posted by FMJ

God does not need partners. If there is more than one God, then the lesser ones would fight for domination and there would be war in the heavens! Ultimately, there must be one God that made all this you see in the heavens and earth; logically, it had to start from one not three!

You are comparing God to Voltron, putting God in the wrong estimation! God has no comparison!

So you must believe that God died when Jesus died, which makes your concept of God perishable.

I believe it is possible to rise from death, so you are wrong on that.


Btw, the fact that you are comparing your conception of God to a cartoon character, should tell you something about the nature of your conception!!!

your original argument was that the trinity is illogical because 3 things cant come together to make 1. the voltron example shows you that this is perfectly logical.

i dont recall saying God needed anything or that God couldnt have made the heavens and the earth without jesus. are you now dictating the means for how God can do things?

a fight for domination and a war in the heavens? this is an assumption based your own sinful alpha dog nature that has nothing to do with the attitude or relationship God the father had with christ and the holy spirit. its also not jesus or the holy spirit's attitude towards God the father. its completely based on your world view and cant be substantiated through scripture.

[THE W]

Originally Posted by LORD NOSE

Matthew 27:46
About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” (which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”).

Mark 15:34
And at three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachthani?” (which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”).


perfect aliens don't bleed and scream this on crosses


The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel. He will eat curds and honey when he knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right. But before the boy knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right, the land of the two kings you dread will be laid waste. The LORD will bring on you and on your people and on the house of your father a time unlike any since Ephraim broke away from Judah — he will bring the king of Assyria." (Isaiah 7:10-17)


virgin birth

answer:

Originally Posted by THE W

something i want to expand upon further,

when Jesus who is God, along with the father who is God, came into creation as a human being through being birthed through mary, he took upon himself humanity.

he experienced hunger, thirst, fatigue, physical pain, and he also did what humans do to communicate with God, he prayed. jesus praying in john 17 is a display of the humanity that he was taking part in.

seems to me that you look at the scriptures as being full of fictional stories...or fairytales. thus rejecting the word of God.

if thats the case....you have a nice day!!

[LORD NOSE]

Originally Posted by THE W

answer:




seems to me that you look at the scriptures as being full of fictional stories...or fairytales. thus rejecting the word of God.

if thats the case....you have a nice day!!

i didn't ask any questions for you to answer


you are in here using voltron as an example for your trinity belief

seems to me like you don't reject the word of god and i do - so you have every right to reject me and treat me like shit - we worship 2 different gods

i believe in voltron and you believe that the father and the son are 2 people that are one who teams up with a 3rd ...being

so if you were my employer, you'd have every right to abuse me and with hold wages because i'm going to hell any way - i'm a sinner and you're a god fearing christian - it's ok for you to get together with fellow christians and burn down where i live - even though when i'm out and about, i treat everyone i come into contact with with love and respect - concern and consideration - i'm helpful to the old and disabled - i give money to the babies generously - despite their religion, race, or treatment of me - how dare i don't believe in 3 part god who is jealous of other gods

[THE W]

uhh....cool story bro...

[Tectrus Moa]

Originally Posted by LORD NOSE

Matthew 27:46
About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” (which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”).

Mark 15:34
And at three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachthani?” (which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”).


perfect aliens don't bleed and scream this on crosses


The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel. He will eat curds and honey when he knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right. But before the boy knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right, the land of the two kings you dread will be laid waste. The LORD will bring on you and on your people and on the house of your father a time unlike any since Ephraim broke away from Judah — he will bring the king of Assyria." (Isaiah 7:10-17)


virgin birth

Mentally, Jesus isn't human.