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Old 09-15-2009, 07:28 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean View Post
^ you're missing the point. You're saying that just because you yourself didn't actually see a plane hitting the building, that it must have been a missile fired from a helicopter organised by the US government
something hit the Pentagon though. There' convenience stores, security camera's etc, all kind of shit pointing at that area of the Pentagon but every one of those tapes got seized by government officials and none of them have been released save for the one security cameras from the Pentagon itself which conveniently records in one second or so intervals. And what they show doesn't look like a plane. Yes it was traveling at extremely high speeds (whatever it was) but there's no way to say "oh yeah, definitely a plane".

So, why not release the tapes of the stores and buildings in that area? Wouldn't you wanna show the public a better look at what happened if it was a plane?

I try to stay away from the theorizing because no one really knows what happened that day (that's talking anyways). But at the end of the day I've got a bunch of questions with no answers and people should at least acknowledge that. Press the government to answer the questions.



and again, as it seems to have come up again, steel does melt at around 2400F
http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasc.../chem99021.htm

http://www.tms.org/pubs/journals/JOM...agar-0112.html
^this article explains the weakening of the steel vs anything melting and goes into detail why which I won't repeat myself.

what nothing in the article (which is written in support of the domino effect from the upper level causing the collapse) is why do you find molten steel
in the rubble of the collapse
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Old 09-15-2009, 07:54 PM   #47
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^ See now that's a logical way to think about the situation, conspiracy theorists take notes from Visionz. Yes there are some unanswered questions and suspicious shit, but that doesn't mean it was all a giant evil plot by George Bush or the lizard people lol.

It may seem implausible to some people that a plane hit and there's no evidence or whatever, but imo it seems a lot more implausible that the government shot their own building with a missile and nobody noticed shit.

On the topic of the molten steel, have you got actual pictures of it? I believe you I just wanna see for myself. I can't personally explain the reason for something like that but I'm sure that there is a reasonable explanation for it that non-experts like us wouldn't be able to think of.
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Old 09-16-2009, 01:47 AM   #48
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^hard to find a picture of it as all the rubble shots look the same but there is this

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Old 09-16-2009, 02:04 AM   #49
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clicked on a video link and they said the last fire was extinguished december 19, 2001
dayum
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Old 09-16-2009, 02:25 AM   #50
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Quote:
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clicked on a video link and they said the last fire was extinguished december 19, 2001
dayum
99 days for those keeping count at home

fuckin crazy right
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Old 09-16-2009, 06:56 AM   #51
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Obviously, we have seen no video proof of what hit the pentagon, but I still haven't heard anyone who believes strongly that it wasn't flight 77 explain just what the hell happened to the people who got on that plane. Where the hell did that plane go then? Were the people who made calls from 77 lying when they said they had been hijacked? Family members have confirmed these calls were made. What is your explanation for that?
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Old 09-16-2009, 08:32 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Embryonic Crusadah View Post
Obviously, we have seen no video proof of what hit the pentagon, but I still haven't heard anyone who believes strongly that it wasn't flight 77 explain just what the hell happened to the people who got on that plane. Where the hell did that plane go then? Were the people who made calls from 77 lying when they said they had been hijacked? Family members have confirmed these calls were made. What is your explanation for that?
that would get into two things, providing an answer and speculation. I don't really have answers only questions and because of that I don't care to speculate too much as you start to get away from facts.

The fact being that there's plenty of footage out there that could show you that a plane either did or didn't hit the pentagon but that we're seeing right next to none of it. Why?

We know a plane hit each of the world trade towers right? How many times and from how many different angles did you see footage of that happening?
We know if its out there, the media has no problem showing you what a plane crashing into a building looks like. (over and over again)


If you'd like to hear speculation though to kinda answer you're original question. Maybe no one was on the plane. Maybe those phone calls never took place and anyone attesting to that was fronting. idk. (looking it up on wikipedia though, there was only one phone call mentioned looking up the passenger log........and who was it to....


Theodore Bevry Olson (born September 11, 1940) was the 42nd United States Solicitor General, serving from June 2001 to July 2004. He is a major figure in the conservative legal movement.


if ya needed someone to front for you^^sounds like the guy to do it.


but have you ever heard of Operation Northwoods?

worth the read if you're interested ----this was a proposed plan by someone in the ranks of the CIA to work up public opinion for a war with Cuba back in the 60's
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

the most interesting part of it as it pertains to this conversation is this part here

Quote:
It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner en route from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuela. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight.
a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to a drone.
b. Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rendezvous south of Florida. From the rendezvous point the passenger-carrying aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly into an auxiliary field at Eglin AFB where arrangements will have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the aircraft to its original status. The drone aircraft meanwhile will continue to fly the filed flight plan. When over Cuba the drone will begin transmitting on the international distress frequency a "MAY DAY" message stating he is under attack by Cuban MIG aircraft. The transmission will be interrupted by destruction of the aircraft which will be triggered by radio signal. This will allow ICAO radio[16] stations in the Western Hemisphere to tell the US what has happened to the aircraft instead of the US trying to "sell" the incident.
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Old 09-17-2009, 09:08 PM   #53
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9/11 was a terrorist attack

Osama sent the tape to U.S. saying it was a warning shot.

End of story
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Old 09-17-2009, 09:20 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun Quan Youngest Wu View Post
9/11 was a terrorist attack

Osama sent the tape to U.S. saying it was a warning shot.

End of story
No. You're just as ignorant as those who claim it's impossible that it was a terrorist attack.
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Old 09-17-2009, 09:31 PM   #55
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I think people who say it is impossible that it was a terrorist attack are more ignorant.

At least there is some EVIDENCE that it is a terror attack.

THe people who carried out the attacks and planned it all admitted it proudly and explained exactly how it happened.

I know somebody can easily come up with a convoluted theory on how it was all a conspiracy, but please don't. Instead, just think of how illogical that is.
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Old 09-17-2009, 10:25 PM   #56
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I just watched this documentary on national geographic called 9/11 conspiracies, and they pretty much disproved all the theories and made the theorists look like retards (including the guy who made "loose change"). They used scientific experiments and evidence to prove the theories wrong but the "truthers" still came back every time with some bullshit lol eg. "they used a super nano thermite that only the military know about!"
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Old 09-17-2009, 10:40 PM   #57
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lol

Lack of knowledge is what drives conspiracy theories, imo.

People do not understand how planes could bring buildings down cuz they have not seen anything like that previous to 9/11, so naturally there are many unanswered questions.
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Old 09-18-2009, 01:50 AM   #58
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all i know is that the official story does not add up. we'l prolly never know the how, what and why.

i have the official report and there are so many holes in it. so many missing parts and the commission was headed by people that had no biz heading the investigation.
the main problem i have is the destruction of evidence and lack of funding for the investigation.



so those 3 things lead me to believe something is not being told or has been missed/overlooked or str8 up covered.
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Old 09-18-2009, 07:36 AM   #59
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See, that's fine.

The problem is when people go from that -> full blown illuminati new world order conspiracy theories without any any reasoning or evidence.
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Old 09-18-2009, 09:11 AM   #60
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Shit, KTL is famous, dude coming in here askin for help from the conspiracy theorists.


Quote:
Originally Posted by beautifulrock View Post
Jesus none of you have any facts straight

Here are some key points to help you

So, 19 guys, 12 who were on a terrorist watchlist just strolled through security and managed to take over 4 planes with boxcutters. Ok, I guess that could happen. I guess it could also be possible for Norad to hold large scale military exercises on the West coast at the same time. I suppose it could take 2 hours to get shoot down orders from a president slowly reading a story of a goat to school children because clearly we know which was more pressing. I suppose that the jets scrambled to take out the planes could have been mistakenly sent 1100 miles south of their target. I suppose all that COULD have happened. If it did though, what the 9/11 debunkers are suggesting is that the US Government is the most inept agency in the history of the world, perhaps, after all the had a cocktail party when they were warned of the attack on Pearl Harbor. Here's where things get a bit fuzzy for me. Hey that plane coming to hit tower 2, how come it has no windows? How come the nose flew right through the building in tact? Aren't those noses made of NOTHING on commercial jets? What are those sparks coming out of South tower just before it fell? What could cause that? Thermate perhaps? Why was building 7 allowed to burn for 9 hours unchecked? Do you think it had something to do with all that evidence against Wall Street corruption that went up in flames? And speaking of Wall Street, why were put options being placed on American Airlines and United stock just days before the 11th? Why was security changed and all bomb sniffing dogs removed from the building just weeks before the 11th? Why did the owner sign a 99 year insurance policy on the World Trade Center a week before it collapsed?

and finally

A steel building has never collapsed because of fire in history. How did it happen 3 times in one day?

Even if you believe the government didn't deliberately bring down the buildings themselves, it's clear from all evidence that they knew it would happen and did nothing. This is your government.


The Project for the New American Century (PNAC) was an American think tank based in Washington, D.C. that lasted from early 1997 to 2006. It was co-founded as a non-profit educational organization by neoconservatives William Kristol and Robert Kagan. The PNAC's stated goal was "to promote American global leadership."[1] Fundamental to the PNAC were the view that "American leadership is both good for America and good for the world" and support for "a Reaganite policy of military strength and moral clarity."[2] The PNAC exerted influence on high-level U.S. government officials in the administration of U.S. President George W. Bush and affected the Bush Administration's development of military and foreign policies, especially involving national security and the Iraq War.[3][4]




"New Pearl Harbor"

Section V of Rebuilding America's Defenses, entitled "Creating Tomorrow's Dominant Force", includes the sentence: "Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event––like a new Pearl Harbor" (51).[13]
In his appearance on Democracy Now!, theologian David Ray Griffin, author of The New Pearl Harbor: Disturbing Questions about the Bush Administration and 9/11, explains the allusion to "the New Pearl Harbor" from the PNAC report in the title of his book, which argues that PNAC members within the Bush Administration were complicit in the 9/11 terrorist attacks.[37]
Further information: 9/11 truth movement and Controlled demolition hypothesis for the collapse of the World Trade Center
Though not arguing that Bush administration PNAC members were complicit in those attacks, other social critics such as commentator Manuel Valenzuela and journalist Mark Danner,[38][39][40] investigative journalist John Pilger, in The New Statesman,[41] and former editor of The San Francisco Chronicle Bernard Weiner, in CounterPunch,[42] all argue that PNAC members used the events as the "Pearl Harbor" that they needed––that is, as an "opportunity" to "capitalize on" (in Pilger's words), in order to enact long-desired plans.[43]
"When the Towers came down," William Rivers Pitt writes in his editorial in Truthout.org, "these men saw, at long last, their chance to turn their White Papers into substantive policy."[32]
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